Portuguese Beyond Borders Institute Collection

John Cardadeiro Interview

Cardadeiro, John

Borges, Diniz

ENG

Portuguese Beyond Borders Institute

8/4/2020

SCUAD_pbbi_00066

Diniz Borges: Well, hello everyone and welcome to these weekly
conversations, every single Thursday here at Portuguese Beyond
Borders Institute at California State University, Fresno. We are
honored to have our guest with us today, a true veteran of the
Portuguese radio in California, and also a friend. The Portuguese
Beyond Borders Institute is having these conversations as a way to
commemorate the centennial of Portuguese radio in California, as I've
mentioned here before, it was on June 10, which that year was a
Thursday. That's the reason we have them. It was in the afternoon. We
don't know exactly the time, but that a man from the island of
Terceira in the Azores, Portugal by the name of José Vitorino
[assumed spelling] according to Dr. Eduardo Mayone Dias from UCLA,
who's done the history of the Portuguese in California is all of us
know that this gentleman by the name of José Vitorino began a program
10th of June of 1920. Radio stations weren't really up. It was kind
of like one of these, what we call them today pirate radios. They
weren't officially a radio station, although they existed as a radio
station. And he began a program called Vasco de Gama, which is,
according to all the research from Dr. Eduardo Mayone Dias, the very
first Portuguese radio program in California and from our research,
the very first Portuguese radio program probably anywhere in the
world. Because radio began in Portugal a few years after that, and
also in the Azores many years after that. And then in 1930, a couple,
a very famous couple by the name of Virtus Avila, Virtuvira Avila
[assumed spelling] and his wife, Celeste, better known as Josiña
[assumed spelling] began the radio program called Castelos Romanticos
[assumed spelling] that lasted all the way up until the 1960s.
Anyway, we have with us John Cardadeiro. Hello John, how are you, my
friend?
John Cardadeiro: I am fantastic and yourself?
Diniz Borges: You are always well, yes, you're one of the most
positive people I know. Let us thank you so much for joining. What's
that?
John Cardadeiro: I was gonna say I'm considering the alternative, I
gotta be positive.
Diniz Borges: Let us talk a little bit about the Portuguese radio, in
your experience with Portuguese radio all these years, I must say to
everyone that we are on Facebook Live, so welcome. The program this
is also going to be archived on the PBBI's YouTube channel. And and
of course, as important as that, these conversations will be
transcribed and part of the Portuguese oral history project that is
being archived at the Henry Madden Library at California State
University, Fresno for future generations. So, John, take us back.
When did, when you of course, first of all, if you don't mind telling
us a little bit about your story, I know you came to the United
States at the age of 10, precisely the same age I did. [simultaneous
talking] So, we share, we share that in common. Yeah, precisely.

We're 10 years old when we left our land and came to United States.
Tell us a little bit about that journey.
John Cardadeiro: Well—
Diniz Borges: What brought your family?
John Cardadeiro: My father immigrated in 1928 and in 1956, we arrived
in New York on December 20. To be exact. Me, my sister and my mom, my
late mom. From there, we came to California and I'm sure I'm
going to be sound racist, but I'm not. Believe me, I am not. We came
to California in the middle of the night must have been around 11
o'clock. And, and of course, you go back in the ‘50s, and probably
even today, I haven't been there for many, many years. The last time
was 1978 So you can imagine, but back then, it was Portugal was
pretty much a white country, white people, there was very little
else. There was one fella that was the African or Negro race. And I
was the only one in town. Of course, he had a certain degree of
acceptance, like he was a novelty and people love him. He rode a
little bicycle down the road with his groceries. I think he was
single, I'm not sure I was only eight or nine at the time, so I don't
remember that much. In any case, that was the only one. I came here
at 10 o'clock at night or shortly thereafter. And to the San
Francisco International Airport, and my father was there with my
uncle, who came to pick us up and we drove over to Oakland, where my
father lived in a house that was owned by a Terceiran.
Diniz Borges: How about that?
John Cardadeiro: Manuel Barcellos, Manuel Barcellos is known, was his
name. And he played Viola. He only played it once. I don't know if it
was, I was playing anything at the time, but he played it once and I
was, I was my goodness, wow. This is like listening to Mozart in
person. He did play a little bit. And, and he was the landlord. So,
we arrived there in the night. And we went to bed immediately,
because we were pooped. And so, the next morning, I get up, probably
before everybody else. I came out, we lived on the second floor of
the house. And I look out the window, and I see nothing but
[inaudible], negros outside in the street. I says, “What the heck is
this?” We only had one in my hometown, which was Eixo, and the
mainland and look at all these people. I have no, I have mixed
feelings to be very frank with you. I watched them and for the next
five years I lived there, made friends and the whole bit. So that was
basically the initial. It was a kind of a shock in a way. But, but
nevertheless, we were in America.
Diniz Borges: Mhm. And so, from coming at the age of 10 I know you
got involved in Portuguese radio very young. What made you get
involved in Portuguese radio? Did you? You recall listening to it
when you first came over to live in America?
John Cardadeiro: Absolutely, absolutely.

Diniz Borges: So, what do you recall about listening? Who do you
recall listening to, in your youth?
John Cardadeiro: Oh, I can tell you a whole bunch of them, including
the Avilas.
Diniz Borges: Oh, you’re, okay so you? That's right. You came in the
‘50s. So yeah, of course.
John Cardadeiro: That’s right. They passed away, I believe, one one
year from the other 1961 and ‘62. I always heard Mr. Avila died of
some kind of a complications with his gallbladder. Not true according
to the information that I received since then, that is truthful. He
died of a heart attack. That's what he died of. But I guess it was
not cool to say that at the time. I'm not sure. There was a lot of
things that were taboo and today yeah, no big deal. Anyway, so, one
day, we were-- his wife Joseña by the way Joseña, you know where that
name came from?
Diniz Borges: No. I don't I don't think the community knows as well.
We just, you know, I've always, I've always read from all the
research that I've done that he was, you know, Celeste and I have his
books, but there's no explanation on it.
John Cardadeiro: All right. I'll tell you, and the only reason I
know, the only reason I know is my brother-in-law, married to my
sister, was his godson was Virtus Avila’s godson, and he has his what
that one day I asked him, this what's, what's this about Joseña? Oh,
that was a love thing. [inaudible]. He called her my Joseña, my rose.
And from, it stuck, it stuck and to the very end of the
program that was Joseña. Now towards the end of the ‘50s the only
time that Mr. Avila showed up on the radio was towards the very end,
before he left, of course, he passed away. And she then took over but
then she didn't want to do it by herself. It was not, there was
something missing there, and I totally understand. totally
understand, but she did leave in the I mean, he did leave, obviously.
And, and she finished up the program. My wife was walking in here
with something in her hand, but it's talking to me, and I don't know.
But I'm gonna back off because I'm busy with a good friend of mine.
Anyway, so that's the story behind the Joseña.
Diniz Borges: And so, you listened to, listened to these people to
these pioneers basically because you know, he was the second person
to start a Portuguese radio program in California.
John Cardadeiro: Yadi, Yadi [simultaneous talking] April.
Diniz Borges: And the first, the first Yadi. Yes, the very first
daily. That's right. Yes. He was the first daily we we don't have
much on José Vitorino, first adventure with Vasco de Gama. From all
the research of Dr. Dias said, all we know is it lasted a few years,
but we don't know exactly how many. And he was. It was weekly, Mr.

José Vitorino was from the Island of Terceira. And, and and I, I
heard an interview that Euclides Alvares, who both of us know, well,
Euclides did an interview in his first years of radio. So, this has
been about 43 years ago with a gentleman by the name of Mr. Frank
Mendoza, which was also a pioneer who had a program in Merced called
Frankly Speaking, which I love the name. Yeah, and it was a seven day
a week program. Actually, he criticized in the interview the
Avilas because he said, oh, the Avilas said that they had the first
daily, but they were Monday through Friday, mine was every day, seven
days a week.
John Cardadeiro: Ah I didn't know that I didn't know.
Diniz Borges: Typically, radio, you know typically radio program-John Cardadeiro: You know there was six days, I remember because I
heard him Monday through Saturday.
Diniz Borges: Monday through Saturday and he was seven days. So, but
Mr. Mendoza was interviewed and thanks to Euclides, we have found
that audio, which is it let some, shed some light on José Vitorino.
He said that he started the program, you remember. And he was
illiterate. He couldn't read or write which was interesting.
John Cardadeiro: There was someone else there was someone else that
was also I am told; I don't know this for a fact. But I am told he
was also illiterate. I cannot mention his name. He's still around and
he did a very good program for a person that was illiterate. My
goodness. He spoke well, had a beautiful, beautiful voice.
Diniz Borges: Interesting. Well, Mr.-- according to Mr.-- according
to Frank Mendoza, Mr. Frank Mendoza, José Vitorino was illiterate.
And then he started later on another program with a gentleman in
Visalia. And, and this program, he would travel from Modesto to
Visalia. And that to me is just unbelievable in 1930s, traveling that
far, you know.
John Cardadeiro: How they get there? What-Diniz Borges: Yeah.
John Cardadeiro: What kind of car did he have?
Diniz Borges: I don't know what kind of car he had to get there.
John Cardadeiro: No, no there are important facts.
Diniz Borges: Those are fascinating things I'd like to discover and
hopefully, we can, you know, maybe through some families we're trying
to dig right now.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah. Through families.

Diniz Borges: Yeah. [simultaneous talking] We're trying to dig into
finding. There's a gentleman in Terceira that’s helping me out as
well, to see if we can get the baptismal records and to see what year
Mr. ... came over and find out a little bit more about him. But
anyway, when you so we've listened to these folks, what led you to
start, and what do you recall what was your very first radio?
John Cardadeiro: My, my recollection dates back to Portugal to the
city, now city back then was the village of Eixo, which is next door
to Aveiro in Beira Literal in Portugal. Anyway, so I always loved
music. I mean, anybody that knows me knows that. But I didn't play an
instrument until I was about 17 or 18 goes everybody played an
instrument. Here I as the dummy. I don't play anything. And I felt
self-conscious about the whole thing. But anyway, back then I began
to listen to Emisora. There was a couple of stations up north in
Porto. ... down the city of Porto. And they have programs throughout
the day, everything in Portuguese, but the music, which really tee’d
me off. What do you what do you got there? That's my wife. She like
there's nothing going on. Right in and just bring your tool with you.
Anyway, so Emisora del Norte Unides. That was the name of the outfit
that on the five or six different types of programs they have
throughout the day and night. And in any case, they had everything
that the radio broadcasters were all, all spoke Portuguese, the music
not so much. So, at the end of each day have like four or five people
throughout the day. And I knew the hours they began and the first
thing that I did listen is so what are they're going to play a
broadcast during their three-hour segment. And they would say okay,
from such and such a time to such a time normally about 15 minutes,
which was ridiculous música Portuguesa. Wow. I came to America.
Seriously. This is absolutely the gospel truth. I came here. I got
another picture here. I don't know.
Diniz Borges: Yes, we do. We have our dean on the line listening to
us. You continue that's fine.
John Cardadeiro: Who is that?
Diniz Borges: The Dean of the College of Arts and Humanities.
John Cardadeiro: Oh, it's a dean? Oh, I gotta put my tie.
Diniz Borges: Hahaha!
Nora Chapman: No, no, don’t worry. I was just checking in to see how
you're doing. I'm racing around.
John Cardadeiro: Don't race around. You'll get there eventually. And
without being [feigns being out of breath] like that.
Nora Chapman: You are doing great.
Diniz Borges: Thanks. Thank you for joining us Dean Chapman.

John Cardadeiro: Absolutely.
Nora Chapman: Oh, you are so welcome.
John Cardadeiro: She's beautiful.
Diniz Borges: Yes, she's a she's a beautiful dean. We have John
Cardadeiro was telling us how he got involved in Portuguese radio. He
re-- he remembers Portuguese radio from the 1950s. And that's
amazing.
Nora Chapman: Wow.
John Cardadeiro: Considering, considering that I'm old now. Yeah.
Most of the mind is shot. But anyway, yes. So, what was I saying?
Anyway, see what I mean?
Diniz Borges: You were talking about how we on how we went when you
were listening to the Portuguese radio in Portugal that only played
15 minutes of Portuguese music.
John Cardadeiro: That's right. So, I came to America, I came to
California to listen to Portuguese music, because of the programming
at the time and even today to a certain extent, was all independent.
They had an independent producers and directors and everything else.
Diniz Borges: Explain that to us, what is an independent?
John Cardadeiro: An independent is somebody that doesn't work for a
radio station in this case.
Diniz Borges: Yes, so they buy the time, and they broker it.
John Cardadeiro: They bought the time, yes, they will go out, but and
depends on the station, some stations would provide the commercials,
and they the announcers would then get a percentage of it. But you
were also responsible to make sure that if the station didn't get
enough commercials, haha it comes out of your pocket or something
like today.
Diniz Borges: Well, there was a minimum that you had to do?
John Cardadeiro: Yes, absolutely. Minimum. Yeah. And one of them was
when, when-- Let me go back, backtrack there. So, I came to America
to listen to Portuguese music.
Diniz Borges: Yes, that is true.
John Cardadeiro: The programs at the time when I came here in the San
Francisco Bay Area, were the Avila Castelos Romanticos was that was
the name, the castles of romance by and that was the name of the

program in English. But they, they, they also broadcast all in
Portuguese. And then we have Mas Dias. Now I met him, he was a chubby
dude.
Diniz Borges: Mas Dias, I know. I'm not aware. Who was he?
John Cardadeiro: Well, I can't give you very much, but I know he had
a problem with his eyesight. Yeah, very thick, thick glasses. And he
used to come daily. Monday through Friday. Well, daily is a Monday
through Friday, in most cases. Yeah. Worked out of Warner Brothers
radio in Oakland, which was then KWBR at 1310 on the radio. Anyway,
so.
Diniz Borges: This was the late ‘50s?
John Cardadeiro: This is yeah, well, he began in the ‘40s, but I
wasn't here so.
Diniz Borges: Sure, sure, but this when you were listening to it,
we're talking about the late ‘50s.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, from ‘56 on, and, of course, woke me up every
day, my parents would turn it on before my mother went to work. And I
was fast asleep. And that teed me off because it woke me up. But
after a while, I become accustomed like everybody else, when you when
your body gets accustomed to a certain routine, you can't, you can't
go away from it. You're there. Anyway, so yeah, he played two songs.
His program was 45 minutes long, two songs. That's it. You could
count on that one at the very beginning and one to say goodbye. And
what basically was a program of news, a lot of news in the middle. I
remember him talking about “I Love Lucy.” And some of the problems
they were having at the time, which I could not relate, that couldn't
even begin to tell you about it. Now, I know. He mentioned one time
the word marijuana.
Diniz Borges: Wow 1950s.
John Cardadeiro: Marijuana in ‘50s.
Nora Chapman: Wow.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, I never forgot. I said, “What the heck's
marijuana?” And all I could remember; all I could remember was a song
from Brazil with that name.
Diniz Borges: Ah.
John Cardadeiro: I don’t remember the artist but “Marijuana [singing
in Portuguese].” Something like that.
Diniz Borges: I don't remember that.

Nora Chapman: Had you heard of hemp? Didn't they call it hemp way
back when?
John Cardadeiro: No, this is long before your time. What are you
talking about?
Nora Chapman: No.
John Cardadeiro: You're a young lady. Uh oh here we go.
Diniz Borges: And so, he basically had a news show. So, he would
take, what is your feeling? I mean, he would take he would take news
items from the United States and, and basically give them in
Portuguese.
John Cardadeiro: To be frank with you. I don't know because the
stations did have a teletype machine from the Associated Press or
United Press International at the time. Right. I don't know if he
did. I don’t know if took it from the paper imagine, it started at
6:15 in the morning.
Diniz Borges: Sure.
John Cardadeiro: So, you know, to translate it takes you a while.
Diniz Borges: Sure.
John Cardadeiro: I would think as I did afterwards not know how long
it took me to make sense to the Portuguese. Yeah, it's not a question
of translation. It's a question to make sure they understand what
you're talking about.
Diniz Borges: All right.
John Cardadeiro: Like the marijuana thing, I have no idea.
Diniz Borges: Right, to bring it to the language level of your
listeners?
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, absolutely. That which was the other side of
the translation itself.
Diniz Borges: So, you were raised with the Portuguese radio programs?
When did you take the plunge?
John Cardadeiro: I did it in 19-- Well, the first time I was before a
microphone, not with anybody, just myself and I and the Avilas was on
their program. There was a, an interview type, like we're doing right
now. Except it was live everybody was together like in a round table.
Diniz Borges: Mhm.

John Cardadeiro: And we began to talk, and they asked me basically
the same thing. There was three of us, there was myself, there was a
young lady that since has passed away. She was beautiful. Dog, I
really, I was really sad. I mean Rosa Maria Bolica. I should I don't
know if you remember the name.
Diniz Borges: I know the Bolica's family, and I know that.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, she was the daughter of she, her mother
Arminda that was very, very into the [inaudible] all her life.
Anyway, that was her daughter. And the other one was my sister. My
sister came here with three years, three years old. Put her on the
radio, speak Portuguese. Go ahead, I dare you.
Diniz Borges: I'm sure she spoke well, yeah, I'm so.
John Cardadeiro: I tried I don't speak well, but that's fine. Anyway,
so we were there, and they and Joseña was the interviewer and asked
me and asked the others the same basically the same questions and,
and that was my first step into the radio business. Although I used
to make a radio fictitiously at home, playing records that were made
of paper. And I know it was just being creative about the
whole thing. But I got into radio, but I always, I always loved it. I
always liked the idea of broadcasting. I don't know why. None of my
family is is a musician or a broadcaster. But I did, not it was
something in me from way back when I'm sure one of these days I'm
gonna call some of those outfits that trace your lineage and then.
Diniz Borges: There you go. There you go to see if you're.
John Cardadeiro: I'm almost afraid.
Diniz Borges: Broadcasters in your in your in your past. But so how
old were you when you started your program? Did you begin one
yourself? Or it was with somebody else?
John Cardadeiro: No, no, I began with Mr. Gilberto Lopes [inaudible].
He was at the time the publisher of Voice of Portugal, Voz de
Portugal. And the extension of the newspaper was a radio program he
had on Saturday mornings. And somebody told him about me. I don't
know who it was, nor do I care, it doesn't matter. He called me up
and can you come in his program was on Saturday morning can you come
in Saturday and talk to us. And let's just do a program together. I
have no idea, but I know what his program format was. So, I had a
decent idea. So, I did go, and some people listened obviously. And
then
they I got all kinds of [clapping and cheering] that kind of thing,
and they loved, I guess they liked our [inaudible] excuse me talking
to each other. And I became a regular so that's how it began. I
became a regular Obrador at the Voice of Portugal. And the, and the-Diniz Borges: And the program was on Saturday mornings, you said?

John Cardadeiro: 8 to 9. Absolutely at a little studio, where he had,
where you also have all of the equipment to print a newspaper.
Everything was there. It had anywhere. And I didn't appreciate that,
to that extent what he was telling me. Now that I look back, yeah,
yeah, he, the man had everything. He also published a little excerpt
or insert; I should say called Compêndio del Grea [assumed spelling].
Diniz Borges: Yes, I remember.
John Cardadeiro: You remember that.
Diniz Borges: I mean, I remember I remember from my research,
Portuguese press how it's been archived actually at the UPC. Yeah.
John Cardadeiro: That's beautiful. I, when I was at the UPC not too
long ago, I was looking for some of the; I was always most interested
in the things of the past. I love it, especially in Northern
California, with did our ancestors do? How did they live? All kinds
of stuff. And I found very little, but I didn't spend that much time
either. And [simultaneous talking].
Diniz Borges: There's not a there's not a lot but the Voice of
Portugal, Voz de Portugal is archived also, in Massachusetts. So,
from there, did you spin off on your on your own?
John Cardadeiro: Pretty much. There was a there was a lull, there was
a break. And then I began with the fellow from Faial. His name is
Manuel Vargas Breda. Ever heard of him?
Diniz Borges: Yes.
John Cardadeiro: He's now in the East Coast, I believe is in Boston.
He does a TV slash radio program out there.
Diniz Borges: Yes.
John Cardadeiro: He's a religious man. He's already got into
religion. That's what he’s doing, that's fantastic. I haven't spoken
with him for many years now.
Diniz Borges: So, you and him set up a kind of a partnership?
John Cardadeiro: No, us no, it's not even a partnership and you know,
Senhor Borges you know, anybody in the radio at any time except maybe
two or three. And that was, man those were very, very in capital
letters, lucky, [inaudible] come to mind as making money and living
off the radio, and I understand [inaudible] from the program you have
recently also did the same thing. Those were very-- everybody else
does it for love. This is a love thing. If you enjoy something that
you're doing, that's your payment.

Diniz Borges: Right, right. But let's talk about let's talk about a
little bit about those two people that you mentioned. So, because you
had a radio you where you collaborated you had your own radio
program. But of course, you know being raised Portuguese, Portuguese
American in any anywhere in California is in the 1960s and ‘70s and
even into the ‘80s but especially ‘60s and ‘70s, Portuguese radio was
a staple. And I want to ask you a couple of questions in that
perspective. First of all, I'm of the belief that the community that
we are today kind of owes itself to Portuguese radio, everything from
Portuguese language programs at high schools through university,
everything from these cultural organizations that popped up in the
1960s and ‘70s. The bands, the folklore groups, the cultural
groups, from the athletica to the Família Portuguese that no longer
exists but existed for many years in San Leandro to the ones in the
valley and even in Southern California. The radio kind of brought
people together. What is your feeling on that?
John Cardadeiro: Oh yeah.
Diniz Borges: What is your feeling of these people? like Steves and
like Costa, like Agnelo Clementino [assumed spellings] who were kind
of towering figures in the Portuguese community?
John Cardadeiro: Absolutely. They were considered to be the biggest
actors in Hollywood in terms of acceptance. My goodness, yes, they
were. There was literally very few people could afford a television
set back then. Not very many. And when the when the color came out,
ask my father, we chose ours that was given to us. Now that was a
loaner. Not as a gift. Top down, just stop playing. Okay, let's go
get a TV ‘cus my now priors kind of want to get off the topic here.
But before that, before, when we received our TV. It took him about a
couple of years before we begin to watch some of the westerns of the
time and then he fell in love. He wanted more of it. When when the
when the other one Abadio [assumed spelling], tell me what's that in
English? Conked out.
Diniz Borges: What was that?
John Cardadeiro: When our original TV conked out, I asked them let's
go find another one because by now he was hooked in some of those
westerns and so forth. So, we went to store, and they were just now
beginning to bring out the color TV. And I remember I don't know it
was a Zenith that was his favorite brand. And and I saw the price tag
and I don't remember now; I knew nothing about credit cards because I
don't think they existed back then. This is like the early ‘60s. And
I says, what are you kidding me? I think it was 300 some odd dollars.
I forgot what it was for that but that is hard to try and
expect, didn't buy a TV that night.
Diniz Borges: Obviously, obviously.
John Cardadeiro: Nothing happened.

Diniz Borges: So, so these these people are like Agnello Clementino
and Steves [assumed spelling] and everything were kind of heroes, as
you said, I mean, people looked up to them.
John Cardadeiro: Yes. Oh, yeah. Oh, yes. They could say no wrong. I
mean, they were idols in many ways. Yes, they were, I mean, what else
can I say about them? I enjoyed their programs, but they got
monotonous after a while because they didn't offer anything really
new or interesting. They kept on blah, blah, blah, blah, dedicating
songs to this and that and that lasted 15 minutes. Well, if they
have a program of an hour, how many songs can you play and that's
what the younger crowd was interested in. That's when bands came in
shortly thereafter. Prior to that, we have Pascua’s, we have
Orquestra Pascua [assumed spelling].
Diniz Borges: And so, and that's when, okay, so if we take these
these pioneers, as you said that they were not very much on was the
same thing here in the valley, the Santos Family Piscas [assumed
spelling], that were known they had a program for example for an
hour, but they would play maybe one or two songs, there was a lot of
talk and a lot of course advertising jobs and you know, and more
people could buy stuff. But then the younger generation such as
yourself, then at the time younger generation came in. How did you
how did you guys look at changing radio from these at the time old
timers? You know, let's put it that way.
John Cardadeiro: I am.
Diniz Borges: These icons.
John Cardadeiro: Yes. I, I wanted to do something different. I wanted
to do a, by the way, I took radio courses here in at Laney College in
Oakland and also at San Jose State in San Diego, San Jose, San Diego
State when I was in the Navy. I was in the Navy here during the
Vietnam War, which I thoroughly enjoyed. Live performance.
Diniz Borges: Yes, I'm sure. And so, you.
John Cardadeiro: I wanted to change.
Diniz Borges: You took some professional courses.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, I took professional courses, yes. I, I the
first thing that I did made an effort to do it was play more music. I
was the first flat out and people begin to, hey check him out. He's
playing music. I mean, wow. Whatever is coming out I have a humongous
collection of music from, from the 1900s.
Diniz Borges: How did you, how did you, John, how did you get records
at the time? That couldn't have been the easiest thing in the world
to do.

John Cardadeiro: Well, I've been collecting since I was a kid.
Diniz Borges: Okay.
John Cardadeiro: But these particular recordings and I'm I could
shoot myself in both feet, because Mr. radio Gilberto Jr, somebody
gave him some Edison originals. I have no idea if they were good or
bad, but they were full of dust because he had him along with the
equipment that he used to, to print the paper. So, I say hey take it
all if you want to. He’s like “Come on are you kidding me? They look
like hell.” But I did. I didn't want to insult the man. So, I brought
two or three of them and they're still there. In fact, one of them,
Mr. Avila put on the paper not too long ago, the cover and there was
only one side actually, the other side was black and the hole in the
middle, um-Diniz Borges: So, he has a place, so there was a place to buy
records?
John Cardadeiro: No, what are you taking about those old ones?
Diniz Borges: No, I'm talking about in the 1960s.
John Cardadeiro: Oh, yeah.
Diniz Borges: There was a place to buy records here already?
John Cardadeiro: Absolutely absolutely. Besides the ones in San Jose,
right. Yeah, no Sherman Clay was one of them, Sears, Macy's.
Diniz Borges: But Portuguese records?
John Cardadeiro: Portuguese records. I got them right there.
Nora Chapman: Really?
John Cardadeiro: I can show them to you.
Diniz Borges: At Macy's, at Macy's?
John Cardadeiro: At Macy's. Yes.
Nora Chapman: That's wild.
John Cardadeiro: That is but I didn't know that. But I'm glad you
said so. Because those, they were recorded originally in Portugal,
under Portuguese brands, you know, Colombia, RC and so forth. They
have their own brands out there. And then they would sell the rights
to American companies. And in this case, they ended up in some of
these stores. There was a place in New York that was owned by a
couple called Monitor Records. Maybe you heard of them. They—

Nora Chapman: No.
John Cardadeiro: No, you have not look under Monitor just like it
sounds. They had a lot of recordings that came from Portugal or the
original recordings that were made there. But they got obviously the
the copies or the recordings of that. And they published their own
LPs. The big names were in those records coming out in New York. Much
Cheaper.
Diniz Borges: Right.
John Cardadeiro: $3.99 or $3.98 per LP.
Diniz Borges: For an LP. But $3.98 in the ‘60s was a little bit
extra.
John Cardadeiro: That's true. But I was delivering papers you see, so
therefore I had money.
Diniz Borges: Sure, so you had built a collection, because when you
went to do a radio program in the 1960s, or even the ‘70s and you
were brokering this time from a radio station, they didn't furnish
you records you had to take your own, correct?
John Cardadeiro: One station did that; one station did that that was
in Manteca. Mr. Jack McFadden, who was also the manager for Buck
Owens and the Buckaroos, of course, he gave me as I walked in, he
invited me to do a show. That was a seven day a week situation. So,
once I can’t do that, I work. So, he said well, you can record it.
So, on Sundays myself and my wife would go to the station, do my live
program, which is at night 8 to, 8 to 10 at night. Then I will sit
there half of the night recording the next seven hours of or the six
hours or whatever was left of the week.
Diniz Borges: Wow.
John Cardadeiro: My program came at five in the morning. I used to
listen to it at work.
Diniz Borges: This was in Man, this was in Manteca, and you lived
where?
John Cardadeiro: I'm sorry, I live at the time let me remember. I was
still single, yeah, Oakland.
Diniz Borges: So, you drove to Manteca to do this show?
John Cardadeiro: That's the work of love I was referring to a while
ago.

Diniz Borges: So, and and, and this show, you said was done on on a
local station in Manteca. And what years were these job? You recall
the years more or less?
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, 1978 to about 1981 or so. The station changed
formats and the foreign language types were gone. That was the fella
that followed the Spanish the same thing. So yeah.
Diniz Borges: But prior to ‘78 you were doing radio already,
obviously.
John Cardadeiro: Oh, yes since 1980, since 19; I'm trying to remember
the years, I don't want to go wrong or not too much wrong. Was 1970,
no ’68, 1968.
Diniz Borges: This was a program that you started with another
person.
John Cardadeiro: No, this is by bit. The other person was already in
the, in the background no this is mine.
Diniz Borges: This is before ‘68.
John Cardadeiro: This is Portugal. That was the name of it or Aqui é
Portugal.
Diniz Borges: And you started that one yourself?
John Cardadeiro: Yes.
Diniz Borges: In 1968 more or less?
John Cardadeiro: In ‘68 around September ish.
Diniz Borges: And in what station? What was that at?
John Cardadeiro: That was the KEGL at 1480 in Santa Clara in the
Franklin Mall shopping center.
Diniz Borges: Okay, and that was a weekly program.
John Cardadeiro: Yes, was on Sundays, Steves [assumed spelling]
broadcast from there when he was let go by his original station KAZA
and the Gilroy. So, he went there and asked me to put a you know, to
announce the fact that he was coming the following week or two weeks
from that. And at the end, of course, I liked everybody, and I still
do. That's just my nature, unfortunately.
Diniz Borges: And so, your program was once a week was at that
station? Other than Steves [assumed spelling] were there other
Portuguese programs or?

John Cardadeiro: Not on that station, no.
Diniz Borges: Not at that station.
John Cardadeiro: And that was the first. That's that's when I began
finally, on my own with my own ideas and everything else that
encompasses the program. That was the station.
Diniz Borges: So, what did you try to do, in your own mind if you can
go back to 1968? You were very young.
John Cardadeiro: Entertain the people.
Diniz Borges: Okay, so but what did you try to do? What did you try
to do different than some of the other people were doing to entertain
people?
John Cardadeiro: I spoke as little as I could. Only the things that I
felt were important to me must be important to them. Because I was
Portuguese, they're Portuguese and these are things that are
interests me. I'm not I'm not a individual that tries to really not
to believe what everybody's thinking or likes or dislikes or what,
but I gathered quite a bit of it from going to social events.
And people recognize me and sometimes said sort of stuff and
sometimes gave me ideas. I don't know, I just, I just want to make
sure what came on the air. verbally speaking, was of entertainment
value. As far as the music, nothing went on the air unless I heard
it, first of all, nothing. And if I-Diniz Borges: You had you had your show pre planned, in other words?
John Cardadeiro: Absol-- even now.
Diniz Borges: Okay.
John Cardadeiro: Even now.
Diniz Borges: So, you don't you don't just take a box of records and
say, “Well I might play one or two,” you know, you've got pretty much
planned what you're going to do for the whole hour or two hours.
John Cardadeiro: Oh, yeah. I knew exactly what I was going to do, or
99% of it. Yes, absolutely. How can you do a program without planning
for it really?
Diniz Borges: Well.
Nora Chapman: Hahaha.
Diniz Borges: So, that's why I'm asking you that. The, the other
thing is, let me ask you, let me ask you a little bit of a $64,000
question. When it comes to now, you're from mainland Portugal, and

the community in the Bay Area, although there's some people from
Ílhavo and other areas, but it is a very Azorean community. How do
you feel? How do you feel?
John Cardadeiro: Like everywhere.
Diniz Borges: Everywhere? That's true. But how, how do you feel? And
a lot of your colleagues at the time in the 1960s and early ‘70s,
were Azorean. How did they receive you?
John Cardadeiro: You're asking me a question. I know what the answer
is, but it didn't apply to me. You know why? Because I made friends.
Diniz Borges: Okay.
John Cardadeiro: And they reciprocated. And I would say over 90
probably 100% now are Azoreans. And my goodness, what can I say? I
have nothing but the beautiful things to say. I remember one time I
was getting off the program I used to broadcast here in Fremont KFMR.
And, and somebody called the station and wanted to meet me and invite
me to a party that they were having at their home. She's not gonna be
able to understand this, but you will. And so, I walked in, and there
was some people sitting on the side. And she says “Oh!” I'm sorry, I
gotta say it in Portuguese, otherwise it won't make any sense. ...
[Portuguese speaking]. Anyway, back in English.
Diniz Borges: So, did you, you didn't feel I mean you didn't feel
there is a plus to being from mainland Portugal. When it comes to
radio and, and, and for example here in in in Tulare County, Kings
County, Fresno County in the Central Valley, one of the folk the the
Radio icons started his program in 1930s was Ignacio [inaudible] who
was from mainland Portugal from Santarém area, I believe, and, and
people just loved him because he spoke Portuguese. I recall, you
know, the elder generation telling me, oh, he speaks like no one else
can speak, because and so you had that upper hand of having a little
bit better. First of all, the pronunciation is different, although
you came at 10 but the pronunciation was different so did people
treat you, I'm not asking you if they treated you differently in the
negative aspect. Did they treat you in the positive aspect, “Oh, he's
he does better because he's from continents.
John Cardadeiro: Neither.
Diniz Borges: Did you feel that at all?
John Cardadeiro: Neither neither. It was it was just like we known
each other all of our lives.
Diniz Borges: And how important was that exactly what you said how
important was that relationship? That's something that's the people
we've talked to in the past have told me that doesn't exist as much
today. How important was that relationship between the radio

personality John Cardadeiro and the listening audience in general?
Kinda have you frozen, John.
John Cardadeiro: Well.
Diniz Borges: There you go.
John Cardadeiro: Oh, I don't think there's tremendously any still
picture. Oh, here you are. Now you are moving.
Diniz Borges: You're better now. Yeah. Little bit of frozen thing. We
are okay now.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, no, I don't think there was any animosity on
anybody's part. I don't even know that it existed to be very, very
frank with you.
Diniz Borges: Okay, but do you feel that the radio programs in the
1960s, ‘70s and right up to the ‘80s when we had a lot of the socalled independent radio programs.
John Cardadeiro: Right right.
Diniz Borges: Which are less and less today, but in the 19, and they
were in their heyday? I think you correct me if I'm wrong, they were
in their heyday, especially in the 1960s, ‘70s and maybe mid- ‘80s.
All the way up.
John Cardadeiro: I'd say the ‘60s in first place, not so much in the
‘70s.
Diniz Borges: Okay, but there were still quite a few independence in
the ‘70s. Mostly?
John Cardadeiro: Everybody was independent.
Diniz Borges: Okay. Do you feel you feel that they had a, a different
connection with the radio audiences than the so-called professional
radio? People now that do 5-6-7-8 hours a day radio? What is your
feeling on that?
John Cardadeiro: You can't do. I did that. That seven-eight hours a
day. Talking about I worked for [inaudible] when he was still in
Morgan Hill, the station I just began operating and he had me on
Sundays.
Diniz Borges: KSQQ?
John Cardadeiro: KS. No, no, no. Yeah, yeah KSQQ absolutely.
Diniz Borges: When it first began, okay.

John Cardadeiro: That's right. And he had me on Sundays from 2 until
10 in the afternoon until 10 o'clock at night. No, at the beginning,
when I'd be three hours or so I'm fine. I'm all gung-ho
Yeah. After that, I began to think of ways not to sing so much. So, I
brought these programs they were either dramas, dramatic shows, like
the old novellas they have in the ‘30s and ‘40s, here in
America, and comedies and stuff that I have been archiving for many,
many decades, and pre-- took care of about a half an hour or more of
the program that helped me tremendously to shut up so, to speak,
and just relax and listen to it. I don't think you can do otherwise,
I maybe you can. I don't know. But that's a lot of hours, man. That’s
a lot of hours.
Diniz Borges: So, and one of the things I like to have you reflect on
both as someone who did radio, and someone who listened to these to
these iconic figures, especially as you said, the 1960s and even
‘70s, especially the ‘60s or [inaudible] de Costas, etc. And then
other names down here in the valley and in Southern California as
well. Now, a lot of them, and it's no secret, it's just they did not
get along with each other. You think that that was more of a show, or
do you think it was genuine? It did build their audience?
John Cardadeiro: Yes, that's, of course. It's like professional
wrestling.
Diniz Borges: Right.
John Cardadeiro: No, let me tell you a story. And this story comes
from a fellow that I worked with for a number of years Fernando
Acevedo, Fernando Acevedo, at a program called Voice of Portugal
initially, and then he went to Portugal for a number of years came
back and of course, meanwhile the newspaper came into, into view by
Gilberto Braga [assumed spelling] but yeah, and the name was Voice of
Portugal couldn't go back to his old name. So called them Echoes.
Ecoa de Portugal, Echoes of Portugal. Okay, he was telling me some of
the stories about what happened before I came to this country Avilas,
where it was Leonel Espido [assumed spelling] in Santa Clara was
another, Arturo Arambula [assumed spelling] so I don't know. You
mentioned a whole bunch of them. And you know, these days I don't
think anybody would show up. What they had, and they made a big
promotion out of it, they decided to have a show and they would
choose a topic that they couldn't get along with or criticizing each
other over this is all over the air. You got it now. So come and
defend yourself. And that was the kind of the theory behind it. They
went to the auditoriums, the Oakland auditor-- auditorium comes to
mind, they will make a table out there and one would sit on one side
and the other sit on the other side. And they began, that place was
jam packed with people just for that, it had entertainment value.
Diniz Borges: A debate, a debate. A debate between them.

John Cardadeiro: And this happened a number of times. This is not a
one, you know, one trick pony, it happened a whole bunch of times.
And that's so there were more united in that respect, have, were they
as united as as they were afterwards. But the only the only way to
judge that is by the acceptance by [inaudible] as he promoted social
events of his own like this picnic, his winter bass festival, and
that kind of thing. And of course, he always he was the key. He was
it there was nobody else even close, well Art, Carlos Goulart was
close. And another fellow that came in like a fluke. And he had about
five or six social events, all jam packed with people. He lives in
the valley and last time I heard he was living in Denair, Humberto
Cunha [assumed spelling], you know him?
Diniz Borges: Mhm.
John Cardadeiro: He is a good man; he is a good guy.
Diniz Borges: I have heard of him.
John Cardadeiro: His program was nothing but commercials,
dedications, and music of course, but he kept that at a minimum,
somewhere and he was very well he was living in San Jose at the time.
And a lot of people begin to say that he's a good guy. And his festas
at IES Hall were jam packed with people.
Diniz Borges: Let's talk a little bit about that. So, some of the
folks especially in today's world, you know, some of the people who
you know, didn't then live the, the ‘60s in the ‘70s of the
Portuguese radio programs here. The the social calendar of the
Portuguese American community was much different than what it is
today. And so, the radio programs and whether it be with their
festas, their picnics and all the events that you've mentioned, they
were the social calendar of the Portuguese American community mainly.
John Cardadeiro: Absolutely. There was nothing else. Where were the
Portuguese, especially those that have problems with the English
language? Where would they go? That was it if they walked to it. In
fact, in our case, when we came here, there was a hall in North
Oakland called Flor de [inaudible] and, and it was about six or seven
blocks from our house. We walked there. My father had no car. So, we
walked there. And, and but those were the exceptions, of course. And
that's what they did. And the problem became afterwards because it
became monotonous. It was the same festas regardless somebody else
was involved true. But the festas the count the contents were very
similar. People are wonky you know you think this is New York? What
do you call in New York, the Grand Central Station?
Diniz Borges: Yes. You’re a popular guy, John.
John Cardadeiro: Popular yeah. So that was, that was the I think, I
think the festas, and the problem was that eventually they became
they became, “Oh they're making money,” you know the Portuguese.

[inaudible] what better than yours. The same old thing they keep
repeating. So sometimes they have two and three festas within a
radius of a few blocks. Look at San Jose even today. Look at that
east Santa Clara and what's the name of the other one 27th I think
north 27th, somewhere around there. They have [inaudible] they have
[inaudible], they have [inaudible], and they have, what's the other
one? [inaudible] This is all within a block and a half of each other.
And then they wonder why there is no people or not enough people. Ah!
Diniz Borges: Let me ask you a question, when we what, what,
Portuguese radio has changed, okay? And as we're celebrating, and the
the centennial a couple of things first of all, the, how do you see
this transition from the independents to the, for lack of a better
word professionalized or the full-time whether you whether one is a
professional or not, but people who make a living basically or who
work, you know, full time or part time or part time for Portuguese
radio, entrepreneurs who have radio stations, there's a few there's a
couple of them as we know the Batista Riviera family, the, this
transition that began in the ‘70s and went into the ‘80s and ‘90s.
This transition what in your mind, John, what? What were some of the
pros and cons of this, of losing the independence and going to more
of a contracted person?
John Cardadeiro: Well, first of all, the only time the professionals
came along, was Sir Joao in the late, Joao, well, we have Aldo Bragia
[assumed spelling] and I think that was it. Was there anybody else? I
can't remember anybody else. And I'm not putting anybody; they spoke
beautiful. They spoke perfect Portuguese, which we unfortunately
never had prior to that. In fact, I, myself and I loved the
independents. Everybody had their own group of people following them.
They had their ideas, they have their choices of music, they have
them. It's just their way. They're unique in their ways. But some of
them they should have stayed home, spoke absolutely terrible
Portuguese, but yet, I like to listen to that. What a bunch of, what
a bunch of BS he's talking about, but it was good. It was
entertaining. See, this is what I'm saying about entertaining the
people. This is about those fights out at the auditorium. But that's
Portuguese for you. In many cases, that's what-- I enjoyed the
independents, I did. And everyone had a festa, everyone had a social
gathering of sorts, from dances to picnics, you name it. They had
them and they had them a whole bunch of times throughout the year.
However, sometimes they, you know, wait a minute, that's my festa
day. What are you doing with that, how come you're choosing the same
date that I have?
Diniz Borges: And you think that what you think that was, that was on
purpose or that was just to make to kind of have these different
clubs, that each other's throats?
John Cardadeiro: I didn't I, no, I don't think it was that I think it
was just they didn't care. If they were doing that and they knew that

there was somebody else with something on, they didn't care. Just go
ahead and do it.
Diniz Borges: Yeah, do you? I'm of the belief that the, and let me
actually-John Cardadeiro: Because I was a victim of that.
Diniz Borges: What was that, who?
John Cardadeiro: Because I was a victim of that.
Diniz Borges: Oh, I see, I see.
John Cardadeiro: Of that behavior.
Diniz Borges: I'm sorry. How were you a victim of that?
John Cardadeiro: Well, there were another program. I have three
social events throughout the year. Period. That was it. Same set
dates not the day itself but the day of the week. And there was
another program. In fact, the announcer, the broadcaster already
passed away. In any case, every time at least one time during the
year they would coincide with my festa, with my thing, and they knew
that I was not making any money and they knew that I was only in it
for the joy of doing radio and and providing entertainment to the,
because my festas were in good shape as far as getting audience
participation to go with. They were in pretty good shape. Maybe I
don't know, maybe it was this, you know, to will? I don't know.
Diniz Borges: Sure.
John Cardadeiro: Yeah. But it happened to me.
Diniz Borges: Do you? Do you think that had we not had Portuguese
radio and in, in abundance which we did in the 1960s and ‘70s? When I
mean in abundance, is these these different voices as you mentioned?
Do you think that the community would still speak as much Portuguese
as we do today? And it's not enough. Obviously, those in languages
would like to be have more and more, but do you think if there were
no Portuguese radio programs in California like we had, because of
the immigration, the exodus of the 1950s and ‘60s and ‘70s here, do
you think that we still would speak as much Portuguese as we do
today?
John Cardadeiro: Far from it. As bad as we had some some announcers
sacrificing the Portuguese language, even so, I don't think so. I
think there would be a lack, at least the vocabulary would be
substantially reduced. But no, I think no, I thank God thank God as a
matter of speaking because they came here under dire circumstances,
many of them but I think they came there was in the mid or late ‘60s
especially I remember very well being in [inaudible] the whole bit I

remember I saw people. Um, I used to live-- that well of course the
festas, those social events of those years, which is not happening
almost to nothing today for young people. And, and the thing that
happened as far as conversing and staying together and make sure that
you go over there next week and so forth. What they were interested
basically, was dance. Where's the next dance? And being in a group I
was to tell him, “Yeah, we're gonna play over there next week” or
somewhere, whatever. And they would all show up with almost like a
guaranteed assistance, assistance meaning people coming in
assistência.
Diniz Borges: And let me let me transition from the radio to your
music real quick. So, you mentioned the Portuguese, the Portuguese
groups which is something or the Portuguese musical groups which were
in abundance, considering the, the the community in California in the
1960s, ‘70s and ‘80s. But they're not in abundance today. They
practically are not, they are nonexistent. So, when did you begin
being part of that musical scene?
John Cardadeiro: I left the Navy In 19, active service, I left in
1967. And as soon as I got home in Oakland, this fellow Maurício
Carlos [assumed spelling] used to be a member of the Pascoal Brothers
orchestra. He was already out of that orchestra. And by the way, they
began in ‘41. Called me, hey, I want you to play for my band. I said,
why thank you. I didn't know I was on. And he explained and then but
that's beside the point. I said, sure. Of course. At the time, I have
been learning how to play guitar in the Navy, and prior to going into
active service now I fooled around, now nothing to shout about but I
knew a little bit. And so okay, so do we have practice? You can come
over to my house and then we'll go through some songs and so forth.
And we did. I did the best that I could. I didn't know what I was
doing, but the one thing that he did say to me was this. You got an
ear. And the second thing, the second thing was, you're not going to
be playing guitar. What? What am I going to be playing? I don't know
anything else. You're going to play the bass, bass guitar. I says
that's wonderful. Except I'm not accustomed playing bass. And he gave
me a week to learn.
Diniz Borges: From then on, you've been in groups?
John Cardadeiro: I'm sorry, from then on never stopped, never
stopped. Our first gig was in Newman.
Diniz Borges: Okay.
John Cardadeiro: I was out there, go ahead. I'm sorry.
Diniz Borges: What was the name of the group?
John Cardadeiro: Orquestra Lisboa.
Diniz Borges: Ah, I remember.

John Cardadeiro: You remember that?
Diniz Borges: I do.
John Cardadeiro: You are not that old, don't give me that.
Diniz Borges: This was this had to be what ‘68, ‘69.
John Cardadeiro: Is, I think before that, ‘67.
Diniz Borges: I remember ‘68 when we got here, I remember
[inaudible].
John Cardadeiro: Yeah, I you know, one of the hardest things is
speaking of bands and so forth. Was that okay? Thank you very much
for the job I'll I'll play as best as I can. But remember, I'm not a
bass player. I'm going to learn alone. Everyone knows as we go along.
Meanwhile [speaking Portuguese] remember [speaking Portuguese] is in
the Azores now permanently. He I don't know if it was Bill Silva, or
somebody else. Oh, no, I know what happened. See this is what happens
when you turn 50. I don't mean to scare anybody. I was at a dance the
Portuguese Hall in Oakland. Now it was the place to be if you were in
a band. You, it's like Carnegie Hall. Gotta go over there. Once you
make it there you make it anywhere. Alright, so I went I was out
there, but not like shot far from it. And there's a whole bunch of my
friends towards the end of the hall as usual, looking for a date,
looking for anything. Somewhere on the first hour somebody from the
stage game, I guess some somebody must have said to them, [inaudible]
is over there. I don't know what that meant. But anyway, so this guy
comes up. Hey, you gotta come up here and we need your help. What? I
don't know your repertory I don't know which what you guys do. So,
they dragged me over there physically drag me over there. And I don't
know if a fella by the name of Frank Rosa. Frank Rosa was their bass
player. And he says he's got a job, but he's got to go to work. He
can't stay until the end of the dance. Oh, man. Oh no, come on. Give
me a break. I don't know it's either-- simple. Really. So okay, they
gave me his bass. And off I went. [inaudible] was playing there at
the time. And I remember [inaudible] and then he looked at me with a
strangest look on his face. And hey, he’s pretty good. I don’t know
how that was, but I had a few lessons playing for Lisboa. So, I
played a kept the rest of the some of the songs I did know. It was
just a-- of a question of what are the keys, what key’s that in? And,
and from that on, they asked me, I want you to come to Newark
Pavilion. Next week. We have practices there on on Friday nights. And
I said, okay, I'll go over there. Get more knowledgeable in case they
call again. Oh, they called again, it was forever! He says no, you're
part of this group now. I said wait a minute, I, I have
responsibilities to Mr. Carlos. And says, no, you just use your best
language and just tell them goodbye. I can't do that. So, but I
didn't go. It was the hardest thing. I could have even done. It was
the hardest thing that I ever had to do is to tell a friend, look, I

can't use you anymore. And you know how he responded to me? Man, I
applaud you. Man, I think that's the greatest, because the only
[inaudible] was the big thing at the time. I'm glad that they called
on you, you're gonna do fantastic. You gotta go, you gotta go, no
problem. I can go to the union get a musician. And that's how it
started with [inaudible].
Diniz Borges: How important were the musical groups to the radio
programs and vice versa?
John Cardadeiro: Equal. I think they were about equal. One, one hand
washes the other.
Diniz Borges: Right.
John Cardadeiro: They needed, we needed their publicity as they
announced social events throughout California, about who's playing
for the band, for the dance. Our name would come up of course, and
and they would need us because sometimes they can you if they're, if
their audience wasn’t all that much and they “Okay, can you give us a
little break on the on the card. Yeah, we did. And that's one of the
things on one of the PR’s that came out where it became known that
we're easy-going people. That was the first band by the way. That was
the first band, [inaudible]. That was the first band that played rock
and roll for the Portuguese and now of course that's sold out.
Anybody that listened to was a “He is playing rock and roll!”
Diniz Borges: How long did the [inaudible] last, you recall?
John Cardadeiro: Well, there was oh, I mean, depends on which one
you're talking about. There's three of them.
Diniz Borges: The original ones, the original ones were the
[inaudible]
John Cardadeiro: I left. Let's see, I must have been must have been
my friend oh, gosh ‘66, ‘67 somewhere around there. About for about
three, four years with me. [simultaneous talking] But they hadn’t
been around that long before I got home from the Navy.
Diniz Borges: We, we could, we could talk for a while and I and I
actually want to have a conversation with you on. We're going to be
doing a series in the fall during our lecture series, John on
Fatima, I'd like you to participate, we have a panel on Fatima, when
I'm already extending you the invitation to participate.
John Cardadeiro: And I'm going to extend you an invitation to come up
here to Fremont, California, which is not down the street, I have a
book over there. I kid you not.

Diniz Borges: We're gonna do it, we're gonna do it, where we're gonna
do it. We'd like to have a present that was our that was our, our
intent, of course, was some of these things that, we're not with
this, but some of the events we're gonna have in the fall. We're just
like they've been the prior years. They've been, you know, at the
university. Of course, we'd love to have you there. But that's
going to be impossible this fall. But I'd like you to participate in
to talk a little bit more about Fatima. So that's why I'm not going
to touch on Fatima today. So, I'd like to end it with a couple of
other thoughts from you, and first of all, is so the community is not
the same that it wasn't a 1960s or ‘70s. We had immigration coming
every single week, as you know, from, from all Portugal, but mainly
the Azores, especially in the ‘60s and ‘70s. right up until 1977,
‘78, when it kind of tapered off as you know, the history as well as
I do. And we had continued immigration in the late ‘70s, early ‘80s.
But very, very little. The bulk of our immigration was ‘60s and ‘70s.
The that community is now older, the people who listen to radio in
the 1960s and ‘70s who were in their 30s and 40s are either very,
very old or have passed on, unfortunately. And so, how do you see
Portuguese radio and the role of Portuguese radio moving forward?
What are your, what are your thoughts on them?
John Cardadeiro: Not good. Not good at all. And and part is because,
as you mentioned, the lack of immigration. There's a lot of people
that you mentioned also that are no longer with us. They're
gone. The, the immigration as I recall it, from those years and even
into the probably the ‘80s, I don't know, I don't keep track are
dead, they're gone. They're six feet under, which is a tragedy to all
of us, because so much could have been done. There's so much
animosity still because of the Azoreans, and the main, and the
mainlanders. Even today. I wish they get off their little pedestal,
are all human beings. We're all of the same, same nation, even though
they are autonomous, I understand that, but they weren't for a long,
long time. And then every time they talk about the word that comes
out of their mouth is Portuguese, not necessarily Azorean.
Diniz Borges: Yeah, we're all Portuguese.
John Cardadeiro: We’re all Portuguese. And so so why is this the
vision? I never understood that if it's that same garbage that I
heard the years prior about the Azoreans going to, or the Azorean
girls, I should say, going that was the guys going to Angola and
Mozambique and and so forth during the war and creating havoc over
there with the girls. If it's there, that's nothing, that you may
have been something a little more important at the time, not anymore.
It's it's unfortunate, that's human nature.
Diniz Borges: And so today as we look at the community becoming more
American and less Portuguese, which is natural, it happens with all
ethnicities.
John Cardadeiro: Absolutely.

Diniz Borges: And especially when there's no continued immigration.
Is there a role for Portuguese radio?
John Cardadeiro: Well, I can only speak for myself, I would say yes,
that I'm broadcasting out of the media what do you call that? Radio
Portugal.
Diniz Borges: So online radio stations?
John Cardadeiro: Online radio. Yeah, we got 48 countries responding
so I. So, there is a future.
Diniz Borges: So is there okay, let me ask you that. Does the radio
reverse itself in other words, when you have online radio, that you
have listeners, and we can have them here on this, since we're doing
Facebook Live as well—
John Cardadeiro: Sure!
Diniz Borges: You have if you have if you have listeners in different
countries who are interested, who are listening to you, because
you're speaking in Portuguese.
John Cardadeiro: Mhm.
Diniz Borges: My question to you is this now does radio have another
role in the 1960s and ‘70s and ‘80s radio’s role was to bring
Portugal to the community and to kind of intertwined the communities
amongst themselves, so we knew what was going on in San Jose and vice
versa and, and, and so, but also to bring Portugal, the Azores, and
Madeira and the Portuguese speaking countries to us. Now, since the
technologies are totally different, and since maybe, we don't have
the listenership or when I say we, those of you who are doing radios,
so the Portuguese radio programs, don't have the listenership in
California that they once did, because people are speaking less
Portuguese and, and more English and so they're not listening to you,
like grandpa used to or or their parents. Do radio have maybe a
reversed role? In other words, is it time that maybe the radio here
starts to tell the world what's going on with the Portuguese
community in California? Could that be a vin-- vehicle and a role for
radio, Portuguese radio to play so that other communities and other
folks who live whether they live in Australia or Belgium, they can
know what's going on with us here? Is that a possible role?
John Cardadeiro: It is always possible I don't know if it's gonna be
a pragmatic approach to it. I honestly am very um, cynical about it.
I don't see us in 20 years, even what we are today, I don't see that.
I wish I did, because I love my country, I love my people, I love the
community that I have been part of all these years, but doggone it,
let's be real, there's a lot of them that also don't like us. There's
quite a few out there that “Who are you on that radio think you are?”

Oh, my goodness, nothing. I'm nothing without you guys, I ain't
nothing, as they say back in Alabamy.
Diniz Borges: But you think, you think that kind of animosity may
have been to an older generation, the younger generation looks a
little bit different there?
John Cardadeiro: No don’t, no don’t. I don't know if that's been
transmitted to the younger generation either. I don't know. There's
no facts. There's nothing to statistics or anything else to suggest
any way, to look at it. I don't know. I'm just I'm just cynical. I'm
just apprehensive in the sense that I, I don't think it's gonna
happen. But I, but the good thing about it I'm not gonna be around.
Diniz Borges: Let's not go there.
John Cardadeiro: Let’s not go there.
Diniz Borges: Thank you so much. We're gonna wrap it up. We have the
dean on on still with us. Thank you, Dean Chapman, for joining us.
John Cardadeiro: Thank you.
Diniz Borges: Any any words of wisdom from you are always very, very
welcome dean. Dean Chapman is our number one cheerleader for
everything that's Portuguese at Fresno State. She's been, she's been
amazing, and we all appreciate what she does.
Nora Chapman: Well, you're very sweet Diniz. I think what you've done
here is just remarkable in such a short period of time just a little
over a year and John I so have enjoyed listening to you reminisce
because it's the story of, of your people, and frankly, so many other
people's coming to the United States. And when I hear you talk, it
reminds me of stories I've heard in my own family, not from Portugal
but from elsewhere and what I think is, so heartening is the
retention of traditions through the festas, through, through the
churches, to be honest, a lot of it is centering on, on faith and I
know for my family from Ireland, that was it, the church was
everything. And it was where they gathered, where they met people
from other backgrounds and where they, um where they worshipped. It
was their whole life. When I meet a Portuguese American girls in the
valley, they aspire to be the queen of the festa. I mean, that's like
the biggest deal and I when I ran the Honors College, the Smittcamp
Family Honors College here at Fresno State, when I saw Queen of the
festa as one of the major awards I was, I would always go okay,
that's a very big deal. And people would say, what are you talking
about? It's a beauty pageant, I'd say, no, no, no, it is a big deal.
You don't get it. This is a whole cultural thing. It's not just,
she's pretty, it's about who she is and what she does with her church
and her family and everything. So, that that's what makes The Azorean
and Portuguese combined culture so, so rich and heartening, and when
we have the gatherings at Fresno State, it's incredible. People come

from far and wide. They walk in the dark. They find these places
where we have the meetings. Diniz, I don't think I told you one night
I ran into two ladies, and we were all confused where we were going.
And here I was supposed to, you know, host campus person, and I'm
like, oh my god, we're walking in the wrong rooms. And they come from
far and wide, from Tulare County, Merced County where the dairy farms
are, because it gives people a sense of home to talk and learn about
the homeland to learn about their place here in the United States.
And so, I really appreciate learning from you too, John, and I hope
you do join us in the fall.
John Cardadeiro: Well, I'll do my best to do so. I hope I'm
available.
Nora Chapman: Oh dear, okay.
John Cardadeiro: Well, I'm always, I'm always on the go, I don't
know. My wife sometimes wonders about me.
Diniz Borges: We're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna get
you down here we want to have, we want to have a fabzu [assumed
spelling] event on zoom, and we're going to make sure you're there.
And then when we're opened up, hopefully soon after that, we will, we
want to, we want to we want to host fabzu because we're celebrating
the hundredth anniversary of Amalia Rodrigues, so, we want to, we're
going to be doing a few things at the university. And so, we're
hoping that you'll be part of it. So, John, thank you again, so much.
Thank you, Dean Chapman, for joining us.
Nora Chapman: Welcome.
Diniz Borges: Thank you all for being part of this conversation. John
do continue with radio, please.
John Cardadeiro: I do thank you for the invitation, it was a pleasure
being here. And I hope that that what I said a little while ago about
being cynical. I hope it isn't true.
Nora Chapman: It’s way too much laughter for it to be true.
Diniz Borges: Well, thank you all very much. And thank you all for
joining us. And again, all of these are archived at PBBI and through
Fresno State. So, thank you, John. We'll be in touch. Thank
you, dean. And thank you all.
John Cardadeiro: And thank you.
Nora Chapman: Take care, be well.
Diniz Borges: Thank you be well, be safe thank you.
Nora Chapman: Bye.

Diniz Borges: Bye bye. Thank you.