Lucia Noia Interview
Item
Title
Lucia Noia Interview
Description
Lúcia Noia was born on the island of Faial. She left the Azores in her twenties, emigrating first to Canada and then to the US. She was a Portuguese radio broadcaster and cultural activist in the community. A leader in health services in the Valley, successful entrepreneur and philanthropist, Lúcia Noia has been awarded many distinctions locally and from the Azores for her work in mental health and her dedication to the Portuguese culture.
Creator
Noia, Lucia
McCoy, Kelley
Relation
Portuguese Beyond Borders Institute
Identifier
SCUAD_pbbi_00010
Date
12-17-2019
extracted text
LUCIA NOIA
Dec. 17, 2019
Kelley McCoy: What is your full birth name?
Lucia Noia: Lucia [inaudible] Noia.
Kelley McCoy: Were you named after anyone?
Lucia Noia: No. Maybe after Santa Lucia.
Kelley McCoy: So when were you born? And where were you born?
Lucia Noia: I was born in Faial, Flamengos in 1936.
Kelley McCoy: Can you tell me a little bit about your childhood and your
teen years? What kind of child were you?
Lucia Noia: It was a very good childhood. Even though it was during the
war, and it pained to see the poverty around us. My parents had a small
farm, and we had also a grocery store. So we were not as bad as most of
the people, but there was a lot of poverty. There was also the
dictatorship, and we were allowed to go to education. To go to the lyceum
before 12. If we turned 13, we were excluded [inaudible]. We were there
to choose the professions – seamstress or waiter or other professions,
but we couldn't go to the lyceum.
Unknown Speaker: Can you hang on? We can hear that coughing.
Unknown Speaker: Sorry about that.
Unknown Speaker: Sorry.
Unknown Speaker: Get a drink.
Unknown Speaker: Yeah.
Lucia Noia: There is some water there, honey.
Kelley McCoy: Yeah. OK, so what part should
we -Unknown Speaker: We were -- maybe -Kelley McCoy: Let's talk about the dictatorship again.
Unknown Speaker: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Yeah.
Unknown Speaker: Hang on. [inaudible speaker] OK. Go.
Kelley McCoy: So was it because of the dictatorship that you weren't
allowed to go to school past 12?
Lucia Noia: Well, the -- was the -- the government. The government
policies that -- and that was a way of rationing education. Maintaining
the people isolated and uninformed.
Kelley McCoy: What other ways did the dictatorship affect your life?
Lucia Noia: It affected because -- I was very vocal. And I disagree with
some of the policies, some of the issues. And that was a no-no.
Kelley McCoy: Did you -Lucia Noia: You couldn't.
Kelley McCoy: -- express those?
Lucia Noia: I expressed those, yes. I even was called a communist.
Kelley McCoy: How old were you?
Lucia Noia: When I went to high school, I was 12 because after 13 we
couldn't be admitted. And when I was called a communist, it's because
I didn't even know the meaning of communist. I didn't know the meaning.
But it happened that in the classroom was someone from PIDE. That is the
national police, like, almost like the Gestapo. Very rigorous police. And
then I was arrested.
Kelley McCoy: And you were only 12?
Lucia Noia: Because -- no, no, no. At the time I was about 16.
Kelley McCoy: OK.
Lucia Noia: About 16. And I was in a different island. And we were in
class, and we were studying Russian and they asked me would you like to
go to Russia? And I said, yes, I would love to go to Russia. And this
girl that the father was a big wheel within the department, was there,
and she started questioning me. And then she said, you know, if you go
there, you will be peeling potatoes and you will be cleaning the floors
and the bathrooms. And I said no, not me. I would be an officer.
But I then realized -- I didn't realize what I was saying and, ooh, the
person was there. So then was a very difficult period because it goes in
the record, and the blacklist, and that affects everything. So, as the
years went by, you know, and I was a teacher. I got teaching credential.
But, anyway, I was leaving the country. So-- but my leaving the country
took about two years because I was on the blacklist. So innocently. When
I was interviewed by the police and they asked me, “So, do you know about
communism?” And I said, “No. We didn't -- in school, we didn't get to
that chapter yet.” And he said, “This woman is innocent.” But they didn't
clear my name, and I believe that it was because of a real -- somebody
ignored clearing. Not intentionally.
Kelley McCoy: So --
Unknown Speaker: Can you hang on a second? Lucia, I need you to pretend
we don't exist. So don't look at us at all.
Lucia Noia: OK.
Unknown Speaker: Keep looking at Kelley.
Lucia Noia: OK, OK. OK. I'm sorry. So, can you-Unknown Speaker: No, that's fine.
Lucia Noia: Delete -- you are going-- [inaudible] you are going to delete
most of this -Unknown Speaker: No, no, no.
Lucia Noia: -- and just keep a sentence or two. [laughter]
Kelley McCoy: So can you explain to me, then, how it worked? You were
blacklisted based on an innocent comment made to a fellow student,
but you still were able to become a teacher?
Lucia Noia: Yes. I became a teacher because later on, you know, they
realized that was just talk of teenagers.
Kelley McCoy: So were there any other ways, any other things that you
were prevented from doing as a result of being blacklisted?
Lucia Noia: Well, in high school. Of course. Each time that I would ask a
question, they thought I was testing the teachers. And they
would ask -- they would expel me from the class. So I would go out. “You
are expelled.” So, I would go out. But, finally, I conquered all those
problems that I was having with the school and all of that. And I
graduated. I got the teaching credential.
Kelley McCoy: Excellent.
Lucia Noia: But it was not easy. It was not easy. There was also a lot of
poverty. And when you are raised in a dictatorship, and you look at other
kids that you go to school with, you know, grammar school, or that you
live in the same village and you know they can never get out of poverty.
That if they are born poor, they are going to die poor. And that was very
distrustful. Very sad. And you have to talk. You have to say something.
You cannot just keep it inside. And I said it, so I had a rough growing
up. It was rough.
Kelley McCoy: Because you were outspoken?
Lucia Noia: I was outspoken, yes.
Kelley McCoy: You had mentioned earlier that you were arrested. Did you
actually go to jail for a while?
Lucia Noia: No. I did go to jail. I went to the office --
Kelley McCoy: OK.
Lucia Noia: -- of the chief, and that was known that once you went to
that office you don't come out. So it was a scary thing.
Kelley McCoy: So did your brothers and sisters?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I had a sister and a brother. They were investigated,
too. My brother-in-law worked for customs. He was investigated because
he worked for the government.
Kelley McCoy: All because of your comment?
Lucia Noia: Because of my comment.
Kelley McCoy: And so eventually you became a teacher and you decided to
move to Canada.
Lucia Noia: Yes. I didn't teach. I worked at the airbase because they
paid three times more than they paid teachers.
Kelley McCoy: Was this in Canada?
Lucia Noia: In Azores. Azores. Terceira. And I met my husband, and then I
went to Canada. And after he died, I immigrated. I married someone in
California, and I came to California in 1963.
Kelley McCoy: So your parents and your brother and sister, did they stay
in the Azores?
Lucia Noia: No. My sister -- later on I asked her to come because my
parents were supposed to come, but I held them back because I didn't
make enough money after my divorce from my second husband to support
them. And I didn't want them to go to the welfare because, you know, in
Portugal on the island they had a little business and I knew the distress
of people that went to the welfare here in America. So I wanted to
[inaudible] them together with me, but I needed to be able to support
them. So education did it.
Kelley McCoy: So you came to the United States with your second husband
in 1963.
Lucia Noia: 1963.
Kelley McCoy: Right.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Where did you move to in California?
Lucia Noia: I went to Visalia, then Tulare, and then when I start
business here, in Fresno, 1986 I moved to Fresno. But I still have my
home -- my first home in Tulare County.
Kelley McCoy: So why Visalia?
Lucia Noia: Why Visalia? Because my husband was -- lived there. And then,
later on, I worked for mental health -- the Department of Mental Health.
And I was a psychotherapist in Visalia mental health services.
Kelley McCoy: Right. I actually read through your book. It's an amazing,
amazing story. But tell me, when you came to the United States, how old
were you in 1963?
Lucia Noia: I was 27.
Kelley McCoy: So I'm sure you had heard about the United States before
you came here.
Lucia Noia: Oh, yes. I loved America. I worked at the airbase. I loved
America. Because I – now, I know about the discrimination. I know about
some issues that I didn't know then. Because comparing a dictatorship
with America was like coming to heaven. So all the things that I went
through after my divorce, there were a lot of difficult times.
Kelley McCoy: Was this your first divorce in Canada? Or your second
divorce here?
Lucia Noia: Here in America. My husband died in Canada. So the second
marriage was a divorce. He was a nice man. It's just we didn't get
along.
Kelley McCoy: Now, when you came to the United States, I read that,
interestingly enough, you worked full-time as a producer, director,
and commentator at a Portuguese language radio station.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: So had you had any experience doing that before? Or how did
you fall into that?
Lucia Noia: No. No, I had no experience. Just speaking, you know, my mind
in Azores. And some people listened and others didn't listen. But I had
no experience in radio.
Kelley McCoy: So did you play music or was it a talk show?
Lucia Noia: Well, what we did was I leased time from my radio station.
And, of course, I have to get sponsors. So I went from door to door and I
got sponsors to pay for the time that I leased at the radio station. And
I kept them for 16 years.
Kelley McCoy: One of the folks that we interviewed was Miguel Canto E
Castro.
Lucia Noia: Yes, Miguel. Yes. One of the oldest programs. See, now it's
very difficult. You know, to find sponsors. But then, the Portuguese
community depended on radio for the news, for somebody [inaudible] Azores
and we get the news from the paper a month later. You know, it was very
difficult to find news except through the radio. I used to go to Portugal
and go from village to village with a small tape recorder to record
messages from the people in Azores to the people here in the United
States.
Kelley McCoy: So Portuguese language radio played a very important role.
Lucia Noia: A very important place, yes.
Kelley McCoy: So when you moved to Visalia, Tulare County had a large and
dynamic Portuguese American community.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: So did you feel at home right away?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I felt home. Because I immigrated at a time that there
were many immigrants during the volcano in Faial, and immigrants from
different islands, and they needed a lot of services. And it was kind of
a mutual help. I helped them to get the services to my English was poor,
but anyone in the world of the blind who has an eye is king. So I was
Queen. So I helped them and they helped me. I never charged for my
services. I charged the sponsors for my radio program, but the
services to the people were free. But they gave me other services. For
instance, they would cook, they would give me soup, they would give me
fried fish, linguica, all these Portuguese things. So it was kind of a
mutual exchange.
Kelley McCoy: So have you stayed friends with these -Lucia Noia: Oh, yes. Throughout. Throughout.
Kelley McCoy: Now I also read that from radio you moved into crisis
intervention work for Kingsview Mental health Services.
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: How did that happen? That seems like an entirely different
field.
Lucia Noia: Well, it started because I wanted to bring my parents to
America. And I knew that just radio be enough to support them. And
support me. So the answer was education. So I went to Fresno State, but I
knew also that I couldn't take too long to get my education and make
money. And I wanted to make – to have a profession that I could be useful
that I would enjoy the profession doing whatever I was doing. So I took - I was looking at my transcript. There were at least two semesters. One
I took 21 units and the other 22. And I worked. So it was very taxing.
But I was so pleased. I was not allowed to take more than 15 but Dr.
Ariaga [phonetic] said you want to take 21? 22? OK. Good luck; next week
you are going to be here. But I thought if somebody could do it before,
maybe I will do it, too. Maybe they did it in two hours, you know,
studying. I will do it maybe in six. But I was willing to do it. And I
graduated and, unfortunately, the week that I graduated with my master’s,
I received a letter from Azores and both parents had died.
Kelley McCoy: Both parents?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. Three weeks apart.
Kelley McCoy: I'm so sorry.
Lucia Noia: My mother always say, “I don't know how come you are divorced
from your husband. Me, I would die if your father -- if I would
divorce your father.” “Well,” I said, “nobody dies because somebody
dies.” But she did. She did.
Kelley McCoy: So did your parents have a strong influence on you?
Lucia Noia: Yes, they did. My father—my mother was a very good mother.
Housewife. My father was very generous, and I learned all those things
from them. The giving, the participate [inaudible].
Kelley McCoy: So -Lucia Noia: My mother couldn't -- you know, somebody you have to keep the
money to support the family.
Kelley McCoy: You received your MSW.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Why did you decide to go into mental health rather than
education? Because you had been a teacher.
Lucia Noia: Yes. And I went to Fresno State to the Department of
Education. And I wanted administration. And I met with the -- I believe
was the dean or so, and he said, no, it's not good for you to be an
administrator. You'd be very good at child psychologist. And I said,
“But, you know, I would like administration.” “Well, you really would be
good as a child psychologist.” I didn't want to because, in Portugal, I
couldn't confront the teachers. I couldn't tell him that this is
discrimination. So I didn't say anything, but he made an appointment
with the psychologist, a child psychologist and I met with her and I was
looking at her and she was so nice and I was thinking, “I am wasting the
time of this woman because I don't want to be a child psychologist.” I
want to do something that would be just I saw myself just in an office
doing nothing and I wanted to reach out to the community to the people
outside. So then I gave up to that idea. I didn't go back to the
department. I didn't know that was discrimination against women, that
women couldn't be administrators. And then with an accent, with not many
years in the United States and I wanted to be an administrator. But later
on, later on, when I got my job with Kingsview, two years later I was the
administrator chief of services for a little department.
Kelley McCoy: Exactly.
Lucia Noia: A little clinic. And sometimes I would think if I had, if I
had taken some of the courses now some of the things that I'm doing now
would be much easier to tackle.
Kelley McCoy: So tell me -Lucia Noia: But I didn't think that it was discrimination because at that
time, I am glad that what I did before was because I was not aware of
discrimination. I didn't know that in America, women were discriminated.
Soon I learned.
Kelley McCoy: So, now, tell me in your – in that particular phase of your
life which you were working in mental health, what were some of the
accomplishments that you are most proud of?
Lucia Noia: See, I chose -- I chose to work in the places that there was
most needed. Most poverty, more crime. I worked -- I was chief of
services of a small clinic in Corcoran. At the time there was crime.
There was only the public health nurse and myself. We could go to some
areas. The police would refuse to go. There were two factions fighting
with each other. And so, I think that it was one of my greatest
accomplishments was in that little community. I have other
accomplishments that I was chief of services for Kingsview in Kings
County, Merced County, and I was in the clinic in Tulare and Visalia and
[inaudible] and I was chief of services at those clinics. And I felt that
-- I felt very proud that I worked long, long hours.
Kelley McCoy: So, in 1986, you are 50 years old. This is-- you initially
wanted to retire at 50, but you decided to start your own business.
Lucia Noia: Yes. It was really the situation is that I wanted to work on
my PhD. And I wanted to -- I have one home [phonetic] and really find out
what happens to these clients with schizophrenia and other conditions.
What happens when they're stable and they go out in the community and a
few months later they come back? And they regress again. What happens
out there? So, I wanted to have just one home for a project. You know? So
I could -- I wanted to go for my PhD and I would use that research, you
know, for my work at the university. Then, when some of the people that
were at the CVRC, they learned that I was interested in doing this
project, and they said why don't you open a home for people with
developmental disabilities? I said, well, it would be good. So I got a
partner and the partner said, “Well, I will do that if we can serve the
people that nobody wants.” So we went to L.A., looked for the clients
that nobody wanted. When we got to nursing homes and we said, “Could you
refer to us some clients that are rejected by everybody?” They said, “You
want clients that were rejected?” I said, “Yes.” And then, that's our
business start. It was very difficult in the beginning because we got
clients that came in with illnesses. Medical illness, mental illness, all
kinds of difficulties.
Kelley McCoy: And Noia Residential Services was the name of your
business?
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: And so there was a home? Like, how many beds?
Lucia Noia: Six beds. And little by little we opened homes for people
with -- now it's intellectual disabilities, but before it was
developmental disabilities. Now they changed. The VSM-5 [phonetic]
changed to intellectual disabilities. And we opened eight homes and
a center -- a community center -- Noia Community Center, and we have 43
clients at community center and six in each home so we have 48.
Kelley McCoy: So your first home with six beds where you got clients from
Southern California, where did that open? Where did you open that, Tulare
County?
Lucia Noia: No. Opened here in Fresno.
Kelley McCoy: Oh, you opened in Fresno.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: And these other homes in the center, are they in Fresno?
Lucia Noia: All in Fresno. I still live there. I still run them.
Kelley McCoy: So, you still run them at 83?
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Do you see yourself retiring? You had wanted to
[inaudible].
Lucia Noia: Yeah, I want to retire, and I'm going to retire. I am making
plans for that.
Kelley McCoy: Now, we had spoken earlier about how a lot of times people
think their lives are over at 50. And that you don't want people
to think that.
Lucia Noia: No. No, I don't want them to think. They have to have dreams
and those dreams need to continue at old age. Until life – life didn't
stop at age 50. But sometimes people stop, you know, developing their
skills. New skills. And, so we have to have dreams.
Kelley McCoy: Have you realized the dreams that you wanted to accomplish
so far?
Lucia Noia: So far, yes. I'm very satisfied.
Kelley McCoy: Are there other dreams that you have we -Lucia Noia: Maybe to travel a little bit.
Kelley McCoy: You mentioned travel. But you also told me you haven't been
to the Azores in many years.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Are you going to go back?
Lucia Noia: Yes, I'm going back. See, each time that I went to Azores, I
didn't go just for a week. I stayed during -- while I was at university,
I stayed there during the summer. So I don't like to go just for two,
three days. If I go, I like to go for an extended period of time.
Kelley McCoy: So, what does -- I'm sorry, go ahead.
Lucia Noia: So, I'm looking for the time that I can go and stay more than
a week. I would like to go and stay two, three months.
Kelley McCoy: So you still have family there?
Lucia Noia: Yes, I have.
because they died before
sister and my brother to
so it's kind of a mommy.
My parents died. They didn't come to America
when I was able to support them so I asked my
come. My sister was older than me -- 12 years –
And she came in their place.
Kelley McCoy: So when you go to the Azores you like to stay there for
long periods of time.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: What's it like for you to be there? What is it about the
Azores that calls you?
Lucia Noia: Well, I love the beach. And I love the people.
Kelley McCoy: Tell me about the people.
Lucia Noia: The people of Azores are very friendly. Very friendly. And
now, I don't see the poverty that I used to see. See, in the first few
years that I went to Azores, I would look at the child and I knew that
that child was poor and would be poor. And their children would be poor.
It was very painful. Now, with immigration, people coming to America,
then things are different.
Kelley McCoy: Well, and it seems, too, that people in America are also
sending resources and money back [inaudible].
Lucia Noia: Yes. They do. And that helps also increase you know, the
level of living. You know, people now they have better houses. The family
sends money to fix the house sometimes to buy even a car. Often, they
bring them to America for a visit and when they go back, they take a lot
of you know, the things from the United States.
Kelley McCoy: So, you left -Lucia Noia: They create [inaudible] you know--electronics.
Kelley McCoy: So you left the Azores a long time ago, Lucia, but you
still have maintained a lot of Portuguese traditions?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I do.
Kelley McCoy: Why is that? Why is that so important to you?
Lucia Noia: Well, because I lived very much among the Portuguese
community. I had the radio for 16 years. Then, I had a TV program. That
now was sold recently. I had it for 23 years. We talked about in the
program, talked about the health issues and so I lived my life very much
in the Portuguese community. But, also, I have a lot of friends from the
other community at large.
Kelley McCoy: Gosh, I know that you know, again, when I was doing
research on you, I was astounded at the number of professional and civic
organizations and associations you been involved with. With everything
that you had on your plate professionally, what gives you the energy and
the motivation and time -- to political organizations, women's
organizations -- why do you do all of this? What is it?
Lucia Noia: Well, because it enriches me. You know? I want other people
to have dreams. And I have to show them that it worked for me. And I will
continue doing the best but, of course, now I am semi-retired. I don't do
as much as I did before.
Kelley McCoy: I have just a couple more questions for you and I'm going
to focus on being Portuguese-American.
Lucia Noia: OK.
Kelley McCoy: So to what extent do you – you talked about your mom and
your dad and the values that they raise you with.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: But to what extent do you think that being Portuguese has
shaped who you are professionally and as a woman?
Lucia Noia: The values. You know. Our parents, you know, they teach us
values. Ethics. There are, of course, a lot of shouldn'ts and shoulds
that -- but those throughout our lives, they add values that we cannot
just set aside. I am very proud of the Portuguese. I'm very proud of what
they have done. Their work, their sense of community. The sense of
helping. They always want to help someone. I used to go from door to door
and to every county asking donations for the different families that were
in need and everybody -- some gave more than others -- but everybody
opened their door and, “Come in. Have a cup of coffee with me.” And they
always made something for me to bring home. Some sweet bread or some
sausage. The Portuguese, they’re like that. You go to a Portuguese home,
they open the door, say, “You sit here with us. Eat with us.” And this is
-- even in the islands -- the poor people, they open their doors to
everybody. “Come in.” And on the table, they have always a white cloth
table cloth. White. And they enjoy certain people. Giving what they have
to share. So that's why I love the Portuguese people. Sometimes, when
they get very rich, they get stingy. I don't like that. But I tell them,
and they have been very generous.
Kelley McCoy: So, what does being Portuguese-American mean to you?
Lucia Noia: Well, I am proud of my roots. I am proud of what the
Portuguese people did in America. I am proud of the ones that I grew up
with that were very poor. Many of them, but very honorable. We used to
call them honorable poor. Because they were poor but their homes were
very clean. And even if somebody went to their homes, they have always
something to treat you with. So I'm very proud of that.
Kelley McCoy: Thank you. This is-Lucia Noia: Their values.
Kelley McCoy: -- yeah. Is there anything that we didn't cover in the
interview that you would like to share or talk about?
Lucia Noia: Well, I want to thank you for being involved in this project.
So, to all of you, so it will be recorded for new generations to be aware
of this time now, and the people that lived in this time. In this space.
Kelley McCoy: It is really -- it has been an honor for us. And I am not
just saying that. You know, this has been one of the most interesting and
inspiring and often moving professional experiences I've ever had.
Candace and I have often talked about it. We want to go to the Azores
now. You know?
Lucia Noia: One thing that, with a dictatorship, is we couldn't enter
high school if we were over 12 years old. So many of the people didn't
have the opportunity to go on.
Kelley McCoy: Right.
Lucia Noia: I did. I did have the opportunity, and I'm very grateful.
Kelley McCoy: Now, one more thing. You had mentioned that you actually
moved. You were born on one island and you moved to another
island.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Right?
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Why did you guys move from that island, and how old were
you?
Lucia Noia: Well, my sister was in Terceira. Her husband was employed at
Terceira, and she moved with him to Terceira, and then I went there
because things were not very good for me in school on my island. In the
high school because I was outspoken.
Kelley McCoy: Right. But look at where you eventually wound up here.
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yes, yes.
Kelley McCoy: So, see? [inaudible]
Lucia Noia: One time -- this is not for the record -- but one time I was
in Portugal. Then. I'm not saying now; then. We couldn't question the
teacher. We couldn't ask a question. And each time I would ask a question
they would send me out. So, one day, I said, “You know, I know why you
are not answering the question. Because you don't know the answer.”
Kelley McCoy: And how old were you?
Lucia Noia: I was maybe 14. So I came to Terceira, but I came with … You
know, in Terceira they already knew that I questioned the teachers. And
some of the things that we weren't – that we have to, you know, study.
You know, and I would question why do I have to study the fly and the
flea when I'm going to be a teacher in a little village that the people
really need a lot of help other than this? And, out. So anything, any
comment that we could make in high school then, they would throw us out.
And after three times, we flunked the class. And each time we have eight
-- I think it was eight subjects that we have to pass every subject. If
we failed two subjects, we had to repeat the year. So, it was a little
bit kind of stressful.
Dec. 17, 2019
Kelley McCoy: What is your full birth name?
Lucia Noia: Lucia [inaudible] Noia.
Kelley McCoy: Were you named after anyone?
Lucia Noia: No. Maybe after Santa Lucia.
Kelley McCoy: So when were you born? And where were you born?
Lucia Noia: I was born in Faial, Flamengos in 1936.
Kelley McCoy: Can you tell me a little bit about your childhood and your
teen years? What kind of child were you?
Lucia Noia: It was a very good childhood. Even though it was during the
war, and it pained to see the poverty around us. My parents had a small
farm, and we had also a grocery store. So we were not as bad as most of
the people, but there was a lot of poverty. There was also the
dictatorship, and we were allowed to go to education. To go to the lyceum
before 12. If we turned 13, we were excluded [inaudible]. We were there
to choose the professions – seamstress or waiter or other professions,
but we couldn't go to the lyceum.
Unknown Speaker: Can you hang on? We can hear that coughing.
Unknown Speaker: Sorry about that.
Unknown Speaker: Sorry.
Unknown Speaker: Get a drink.
Unknown Speaker: Yeah.
Lucia Noia: There is some water there, honey.
Kelley McCoy: Yeah. OK, so what part should
we -Unknown Speaker: We were -- maybe -Kelley McCoy: Let's talk about the dictatorship again.
Unknown Speaker: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Yeah.
Unknown Speaker: Hang on. [inaudible speaker] OK. Go.
Kelley McCoy: So was it because of the dictatorship that you weren't
allowed to go to school past 12?
Lucia Noia: Well, the -- was the -- the government. The government
policies that -- and that was a way of rationing education. Maintaining
the people isolated and uninformed.
Kelley McCoy: What other ways did the dictatorship affect your life?
Lucia Noia: It affected because -- I was very vocal. And I disagree with
some of the policies, some of the issues. And that was a no-no.
Kelley McCoy: Did you -Lucia Noia: You couldn't.
Kelley McCoy: -- express those?
Lucia Noia: I expressed those, yes. I even was called a communist.
Kelley McCoy: How old were you?
Lucia Noia: When I went to high school, I was 12 because after 13 we
couldn't be admitted. And when I was called a communist, it's because
I didn't even know the meaning of communist. I didn't know the meaning.
But it happened that in the classroom was someone from PIDE. That is the
national police, like, almost like the Gestapo. Very rigorous police. And
then I was arrested.
Kelley McCoy: And you were only 12?
Lucia Noia: Because -- no, no, no. At the time I was about 16.
Kelley McCoy: OK.
Lucia Noia: About 16. And I was in a different island. And we were in
class, and we were studying Russian and they asked me would you like to
go to Russia? And I said, yes, I would love to go to Russia. And this
girl that the father was a big wheel within the department, was there,
and she started questioning me. And then she said, you know, if you go
there, you will be peeling potatoes and you will be cleaning the floors
and the bathrooms. And I said no, not me. I would be an officer.
But I then realized -- I didn't realize what I was saying and, ooh, the
person was there. So then was a very difficult period because it goes in
the record, and the blacklist, and that affects everything. So, as the
years went by, you know, and I was a teacher. I got teaching credential.
But, anyway, I was leaving the country. So-- but my leaving the country
took about two years because I was on the blacklist. So innocently. When
I was interviewed by the police and they asked me, “So, do you know about
communism?” And I said, “No. We didn't -- in school, we didn't get to
that chapter yet.” And he said, “This woman is innocent.” But they didn't
clear my name, and I believe that it was because of a real -- somebody
ignored clearing. Not intentionally.
Kelley McCoy: So --
Unknown Speaker: Can you hang on a second? Lucia, I need you to pretend
we don't exist. So don't look at us at all.
Lucia Noia: OK.
Unknown Speaker: Keep looking at Kelley.
Lucia Noia: OK, OK. OK. I'm sorry. So, can you-Unknown Speaker: No, that's fine.
Lucia Noia: Delete -- you are going-- [inaudible] you are going to delete
most of this -Unknown Speaker: No, no, no.
Lucia Noia: -- and just keep a sentence or two. [laughter]
Kelley McCoy: So can you explain to me, then, how it worked? You were
blacklisted based on an innocent comment made to a fellow student,
but you still were able to become a teacher?
Lucia Noia: Yes. I became a teacher because later on, you know, they
realized that was just talk of teenagers.
Kelley McCoy: So were there any other ways, any other things that you
were prevented from doing as a result of being blacklisted?
Lucia Noia: Well, in high school. Of course. Each time that I would ask a
question, they thought I was testing the teachers. And they
would ask -- they would expel me from the class. So I would go out. “You
are expelled.” So, I would go out. But, finally, I conquered all those
problems that I was having with the school and all of that. And I
graduated. I got the teaching credential.
Kelley McCoy: Excellent.
Lucia Noia: But it was not easy. It was not easy. There was also a lot of
poverty. And when you are raised in a dictatorship, and you look at other
kids that you go to school with, you know, grammar school, or that you
live in the same village and you know they can never get out of poverty.
That if they are born poor, they are going to die poor. And that was very
distrustful. Very sad. And you have to talk. You have to say something.
You cannot just keep it inside. And I said it, so I had a rough growing
up. It was rough.
Kelley McCoy: Because you were outspoken?
Lucia Noia: I was outspoken, yes.
Kelley McCoy: You had mentioned earlier that you were arrested. Did you
actually go to jail for a while?
Lucia Noia: No. I did go to jail. I went to the office --
Kelley McCoy: OK.
Lucia Noia: -- of the chief, and that was known that once you went to
that office you don't come out. So it was a scary thing.
Kelley McCoy: So did your brothers and sisters?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I had a sister and a brother. They were investigated,
too. My brother-in-law worked for customs. He was investigated because
he worked for the government.
Kelley McCoy: All because of your comment?
Lucia Noia: Because of my comment.
Kelley McCoy: And so eventually you became a teacher and you decided to
move to Canada.
Lucia Noia: Yes. I didn't teach. I worked at the airbase because they
paid three times more than they paid teachers.
Kelley McCoy: Was this in Canada?
Lucia Noia: In Azores. Azores. Terceira. And I met my husband, and then I
went to Canada. And after he died, I immigrated. I married someone in
California, and I came to California in 1963.
Kelley McCoy: So your parents and your brother and sister, did they stay
in the Azores?
Lucia Noia: No. My sister -- later on I asked her to come because my
parents were supposed to come, but I held them back because I didn't
make enough money after my divorce from my second husband to support
them. And I didn't want them to go to the welfare because, you know, in
Portugal on the island they had a little business and I knew the distress
of people that went to the welfare here in America. So I wanted to
[inaudible] them together with me, but I needed to be able to support
them. So education did it.
Kelley McCoy: So you came to the United States with your second husband
in 1963.
Lucia Noia: 1963.
Kelley McCoy: Right.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Where did you move to in California?
Lucia Noia: I went to Visalia, then Tulare, and then when I start
business here, in Fresno, 1986 I moved to Fresno. But I still have my
home -- my first home in Tulare County.
Kelley McCoy: So why Visalia?
Lucia Noia: Why Visalia? Because my husband was -- lived there. And then,
later on, I worked for mental health -- the Department of Mental Health.
And I was a psychotherapist in Visalia mental health services.
Kelley McCoy: Right. I actually read through your book. It's an amazing,
amazing story. But tell me, when you came to the United States, how old
were you in 1963?
Lucia Noia: I was 27.
Kelley McCoy: So I'm sure you had heard about the United States before
you came here.
Lucia Noia: Oh, yes. I loved America. I worked at the airbase. I loved
America. Because I – now, I know about the discrimination. I know about
some issues that I didn't know then. Because comparing a dictatorship
with America was like coming to heaven. So all the things that I went
through after my divorce, there were a lot of difficult times.
Kelley McCoy: Was this your first divorce in Canada? Or your second
divorce here?
Lucia Noia: Here in America. My husband died in Canada. So the second
marriage was a divorce. He was a nice man. It's just we didn't get
along.
Kelley McCoy: Now, when you came to the United States, I read that,
interestingly enough, you worked full-time as a producer, director,
and commentator at a Portuguese language radio station.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: So had you had any experience doing that before? Or how did
you fall into that?
Lucia Noia: No. No, I had no experience. Just speaking, you know, my mind
in Azores. And some people listened and others didn't listen. But I had
no experience in radio.
Kelley McCoy: So did you play music or was it a talk show?
Lucia Noia: Well, what we did was I leased time from my radio station.
And, of course, I have to get sponsors. So I went from door to door and I
got sponsors to pay for the time that I leased at the radio station. And
I kept them for 16 years.
Kelley McCoy: One of the folks that we interviewed was Miguel Canto E
Castro.
Lucia Noia: Yes, Miguel. Yes. One of the oldest programs. See, now it's
very difficult. You know, to find sponsors. But then, the Portuguese
community depended on radio for the news, for somebody [inaudible] Azores
and we get the news from the paper a month later. You know, it was very
difficult to find news except through the radio. I used to go to Portugal
and go from village to village with a small tape recorder to record
messages from the people in Azores to the people here in the United
States.
Kelley McCoy: So Portuguese language radio played a very important role.
Lucia Noia: A very important place, yes.
Kelley McCoy: So when you moved to Visalia, Tulare County had a large and
dynamic Portuguese American community.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: So did you feel at home right away?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I felt home. Because I immigrated at a time that there
were many immigrants during the volcano in Faial, and immigrants from
different islands, and they needed a lot of services. And it was kind of
a mutual help. I helped them to get the services to my English was poor,
but anyone in the world of the blind who has an eye is king. So I was
Queen. So I helped them and they helped me. I never charged for my
services. I charged the sponsors for my radio program, but the
services to the people were free. But they gave me other services. For
instance, they would cook, they would give me soup, they would give me
fried fish, linguica, all these Portuguese things. So it was kind of a
mutual exchange.
Kelley McCoy: So have you stayed friends with these -Lucia Noia: Oh, yes. Throughout. Throughout.
Kelley McCoy: Now I also read that from radio you moved into crisis
intervention work for Kingsview Mental health Services.
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: How did that happen? That seems like an entirely different
field.
Lucia Noia: Well, it started because I wanted to bring my parents to
America. And I knew that just radio be enough to support them. And
support me. So the answer was education. So I went to Fresno State, but I
knew also that I couldn't take too long to get my education and make
money. And I wanted to make – to have a profession that I could be useful
that I would enjoy the profession doing whatever I was doing. So I took - I was looking at my transcript. There were at least two semesters. One
I took 21 units and the other 22. And I worked. So it was very taxing.
But I was so pleased. I was not allowed to take more than 15 but Dr.
Ariaga [phonetic] said you want to take 21? 22? OK. Good luck; next week
you are going to be here. But I thought if somebody could do it before,
maybe I will do it, too. Maybe they did it in two hours, you know,
studying. I will do it maybe in six. But I was willing to do it. And I
graduated and, unfortunately, the week that I graduated with my master’s,
I received a letter from Azores and both parents had died.
Kelley McCoy: Both parents?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. Three weeks apart.
Kelley McCoy: I'm so sorry.
Lucia Noia: My mother always say, “I don't know how come you are divorced
from your husband. Me, I would die if your father -- if I would
divorce your father.” “Well,” I said, “nobody dies because somebody
dies.” But she did. She did.
Kelley McCoy: So did your parents have a strong influence on you?
Lucia Noia: Yes, they did. My father—my mother was a very good mother.
Housewife. My father was very generous, and I learned all those things
from them. The giving, the participate [inaudible].
Kelley McCoy: So -Lucia Noia: My mother couldn't -- you know, somebody you have to keep the
money to support the family.
Kelley McCoy: You received your MSW.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: Why did you decide to go into mental health rather than
education? Because you had been a teacher.
Lucia Noia: Yes. And I went to Fresno State to the Department of
Education. And I wanted administration. And I met with the -- I believe
was the dean or so, and he said, no, it's not good for you to be an
administrator. You'd be very good at child psychologist. And I said,
“But, you know, I would like administration.” “Well, you really would be
good as a child psychologist.” I didn't want to because, in Portugal, I
couldn't confront the teachers. I couldn't tell him that this is
discrimination. So I didn't say anything, but he made an appointment
with the psychologist, a child psychologist and I met with her and I was
looking at her and she was so nice and I was thinking, “I am wasting the
time of this woman because I don't want to be a child psychologist.” I
want to do something that would be just I saw myself just in an office
doing nothing and I wanted to reach out to the community to the people
outside. So then I gave up to that idea. I didn't go back to the
department. I didn't know that was discrimination against women, that
women couldn't be administrators. And then with an accent, with not many
years in the United States and I wanted to be an administrator. But later
on, later on, when I got my job with Kingsview, two years later I was the
administrator chief of services for a little department.
Kelley McCoy: Exactly.
Lucia Noia: A little clinic. And sometimes I would think if I had, if I
had taken some of the courses now some of the things that I'm doing now
would be much easier to tackle.
Kelley McCoy: So tell me -Lucia Noia: But I didn't think that it was discrimination because at that
time, I am glad that what I did before was because I was not aware of
discrimination. I didn't know that in America, women were discriminated.
Soon I learned.
Kelley McCoy: So, now, tell me in your – in that particular phase of your
life which you were working in mental health, what were some of the
accomplishments that you are most proud of?
Lucia Noia: See, I chose -- I chose to work in the places that there was
most needed. Most poverty, more crime. I worked -- I was chief of
services of a small clinic in Corcoran. At the time there was crime.
There was only the public health nurse and myself. We could go to some
areas. The police would refuse to go. There were two factions fighting
with each other. And so, I think that it was one of my greatest
accomplishments was in that little community. I have other
accomplishments that I was chief of services for Kingsview in Kings
County, Merced County, and I was in the clinic in Tulare and Visalia and
[inaudible] and I was chief of services at those clinics. And I felt that
-- I felt very proud that I worked long, long hours.
Kelley McCoy: So, in 1986, you are 50 years old. This is-- you initially
wanted to retire at 50, but you decided to start your own business.
Lucia Noia: Yes. It was really the situation is that I wanted to work on
my PhD. And I wanted to -- I have one home [phonetic] and really find out
what happens to these clients with schizophrenia and other conditions.
What happens when they're stable and they go out in the community and a
few months later they come back? And they regress again. What happens
out there? So, I wanted to have just one home for a project. You know? So
I could -- I wanted to go for my PhD and I would use that research, you
know, for my work at the university. Then, when some of the people that
were at the CVRC, they learned that I was interested in doing this
project, and they said why don't you open a home for people with
developmental disabilities? I said, well, it would be good. So I got a
partner and the partner said, “Well, I will do that if we can serve the
people that nobody wants.” So we went to L.A., looked for the clients
that nobody wanted. When we got to nursing homes and we said, “Could you
refer to us some clients that are rejected by everybody?” They said, “You
want clients that were rejected?” I said, “Yes.” And then, that's our
business start. It was very difficult in the beginning because we got
clients that came in with illnesses. Medical illness, mental illness, all
kinds of difficulties.
Kelley McCoy: And Noia Residential Services was the name of your
business?
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: And so there was a home? Like, how many beds?
Lucia Noia: Six beds. And little by little we opened homes for people
with -- now it's intellectual disabilities, but before it was
developmental disabilities. Now they changed. The VSM-5 [phonetic]
changed to intellectual disabilities. And we opened eight homes and
a center -- a community center -- Noia Community Center, and we have 43
clients at community center and six in each home so we have 48.
Kelley McCoy: So your first home with six beds where you got clients from
Southern California, where did that open? Where did you open that, Tulare
County?
Lucia Noia: No. Opened here in Fresno.
Kelley McCoy: Oh, you opened in Fresno.
Lucia Noia: Yeah.
Kelley McCoy: And these other homes in the center, are they in Fresno?
Lucia Noia: All in Fresno. I still live there. I still run them.
Kelley McCoy: So, you still run them at 83?
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Do you see yourself retiring? You had wanted to
[inaudible].
Lucia Noia: Yeah, I want to retire, and I'm going to retire. I am making
plans for that.
Kelley McCoy: Now, we had spoken earlier about how a lot of times people
think their lives are over at 50. And that you don't want people
to think that.
Lucia Noia: No. No, I don't want them to think. They have to have dreams
and those dreams need to continue at old age. Until life – life didn't
stop at age 50. But sometimes people stop, you know, developing their
skills. New skills. And, so we have to have dreams.
Kelley McCoy: Have you realized the dreams that you wanted to accomplish
so far?
Lucia Noia: So far, yes. I'm very satisfied.
Kelley McCoy: Are there other dreams that you have we -Lucia Noia: Maybe to travel a little bit.
Kelley McCoy: You mentioned travel. But you also told me you haven't been
to the Azores in many years.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Are you going to go back?
Lucia Noia: Yes, I'm going back. See, each time that I went to Azores, I
didn't go just for a week. I stayed during -- while I was at university,
I stayed there during the summer. So I don't like to go just for two,
three days. If I go, I like to go for an extended period of time.
Kelley McCoy: So, what does -- I'm sorry, go ahead.
Lucia Noia: So, I'm looking for the time that I can go and stay more than
a week. I would like to go and stay two, three months.
Kelley McCoy: So you still have family there?
Lucia Noia: Yes, I have.
because they died before
sister and my brother to
so it's kind of a mommy.
My parents died. They didn't come to America
when I was able to support them so I asked my
come. My sister was older than me -- 12 years –
And she came in their place.
Kelley McCoy: So when you go to the Azores you like to stay there for
long periods of time.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: What's it like for you to be there? What is it about the
Azores that calls you?
Lucia Noia: Well, I love the beach. And I love the people.
Kelley McCoy: Tell me about the people.
Lucia Noia: The people of Azores are very friendly. Very friendly. And
now, I don't see the poverty that I used to see. See, in the first few
years that I went to Azores, I would look at the child and I knew that
that child was poor and would be poor. And their children would be poor.
It was very painful. Now, with immigration, people coming to America,
then things are different.
Kelley McCoy: Well, and it seems, too, that people in America are also
sending resources and money back [inaudible].
Lucia Noia: Yes. They do. And that helps also increase you know, the
level of living. You know, people now they have better houses. The family
sends money to fix the house sometimes to buy even a car. Often, they
bring them to America for a visit and when they go back, they take a lot
of you know, the things from the United States.
Kelley McCoy: So, you left -Lucia Noia: They create [inaudible] you know--electronics.
Kelley McCoy: So you left the Azores a long time ago, Lucia, but you
still have maintained a lot of Portuguese traditions?
Lucia Noia: Yeah. I do.
Kelley McCoy: Why is that? Why is that so important to you?
Lucia Noia: Well, because I lived very much among the Portuguese
community. I had the radio for 16 years. Then, I had a TV program. That
now was sold recently. I had it for 23 years. We talked about in the
program, talked about the health issues and so I lived my life very much
in the Portuguese community. But, also, I have a lot of friends from the
other community at large.
Kelley McCoy: Gosh, I know that you know, again, when I was doing
research on you, I was astounded at the number of professional and civic
organizations and associations you been involved with. With everything
that you had on your plate professionally, what gives you the energy and
the motivation and time -- to political organizations, women's
organizations -- why do you do all of this? What is it?
Lucia Noia: Well, because it enriches me. You know? I want other people
to have dreams. And I have to show them that it worked for me. And I will
continue doing the best but, of course, now I am semi-retired. I don't do
as much as I did before.
Kelley McCoy: I have just a couple more questions for you and I'm going
to focus on being Portuguese-American.
Lucia Noia: OK.
Kelley McCoy: So to what extent do you – you talked about your mom and
your dad and the values that they raise you with.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: But to what extent do you think that being Portuguese has
shaped who you are professionally and as a woman?
Lucia Noia: The values. You know. Our parents, you know, they teach us
values. Ethics. There are, of course, a lot of shouldn'ts and shoulds
that -- but those throughout our lives, they add values that we cannot
just set aside. I am very proud of the Portuguese. I'm very proud of what
they have done. Their work, their sense of community. The sense of
helping. They always want to help someone. I used to go from door to door
and to every county asking donations for the different families that were
in need and everybody -- some gave more than others -- but everybody
opened their door and, “Come in. Have a cup of coffee with me.” And they
always made something for me to bring home. Some sweet bread or some
sausage. The Portuguese, they’re like that. You go to a Portuguese home,
they open the door, say, “You sit here with us. Eat with us.” And this is
-- even in the islands -- the poor people, they open their doors to
everybody. “Come in.” And on the table, they have always a white cloth
table cloth. White. And they enjoy certain people. Giving what they have
to share. So that's why I love the Portuguese people. Sometimes, when
they get very rich, they get stingy. I don't like that. But I tell them,
and they have been very generous.
Kelley McCoy: So, what does being Portuguese-American mean to you?
Lucia Noia: Well, I am proud of my roots. I am proud of what the
Portuguese people did in America. I am proud of the ones that I grew up
with that were very poor. Many of them, but very honorable. We used to
call them honorable poor. Because they were poor but their homes were
very clean. And even if somebody went to their homes, they have always
something to treat you with. So I'm very proud of that.
Kelley McCoy: Thank you. This is-Lucia Noia: Their values.
Kelley McCoy: -- yeah. Is there anything that we didn't cover in the
interview that you would like to share or talk about?
Lucia Noia: Well, I want to thank you for being involved in this project.
So, to all of you, so it will be recorded for new generations to be aware
of this time now, and the people that lived in this time. In this space.
Kelley McCoy: It is really -- it has been an honor for us. And I am not
just saying that. You know, this has been one of the most interesting and
inspiring and often moving professional experiences I've ever had.
Candace and I have often talked about it. We want to go to the Azores
now. You know?
Lucia Noia: One thing that, with a dictatorship, is we couldn't enter
high school if we were over 12 years old. So many of the people didn't
have the opportunity to go on.
Kelley McCoy: Right.
Lucia Noia: I did. I did have the opportunity, and I'm very grateful.
Kelley McCoy: Now, one more thing. You had mentioned that you actually
moved. You were born on one island and you moved to another
island.
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Right?
Lucia Noia: Yes.
Kelley McCoy: Why did you guys move from that island, and how old were
you?
Lucia Noia: Well, my sister was in Terceira. Her husband was employed at
Terceira, and she moved with him to Terceira, and then I went there
because things were not very good for me in school on my island. In the
high school because I was outspoken.
Kelley McCoy: Right. But look at where you eventually wound up here.
Lucia Noia: Yes. Yes, yes.
Kelley McCoy: So, see? [inaudible]
Lucia Noia: One time -- this is not for the record -- but one time I was
in Portugal. Then. I'm not saying now; then. We couldn't question the
teacher. We couldn't ask a question. And each time I would ask a question
they would send me out. So, one day, I said, “You know, I know why you
are not answering the question. Because you don't know the answer.”
Kelley McCoy: And how old were you?
Lucia Noia: I was maybe 14. So I came to Terceira, but I came with … You
know, in Terceira they already knew that I questioned the teachers. And
some of the things that we weren't – that we have to, you know, study.
You know, and I would question why do I have to study the fly and the
flea when I'm going to be a teacher in a little village that the people
really need a lot of help other than this? And, out. So anything, any
comment that we could make in high school then, they would throw us out.
And after three times, we flunked the class. And each time we have eight
-- I think it was eight subjects that we have to pass every subject. If
we failed two subjects, we had to repeat the year. So, it was a little
bit kind of stressful.