Hoang Chi interview
Item
Title
Hoang Chi interview
Creator
Chi, Hoang
Banh, Jenny
Relation
Central Valley Southeast Asian Successful Voices
Coverage
Fresno, California
Date
2017
Rights
Copyright has been transferred to Fresno State
Identifier
SCMS_casv_00016
extracted text
>> Hello, good morning on our -- actually afternoon on our lovely day. Thank you for consenting to be
interviewed for a new archive at Fresno State University called Successful Southeast Asians. If you can
please state your name and spell it.
>> Hi, everyone. My name is Hoang Chi Truong Smith. And Hoang Chi is spelled HO-A-N-G, C-H-I. My
maiden name is T-R-U-O-N-G. And my married name is Smith, S-M-I-T-H.
>> Thank you, Ms. Chi. If you can actually give me verbal permission to interview you for our new
Successful Southeast Asian archive.
>> Yes, it's my pleasure. I do give you permission.
>> Great, and also you might want to mention the book that you wrote so the students can go buy your
book.
>> Yeah, absolutely. I'm happy to announce the recently-published book. It's called, "TigerFish," one word.
It's the memoirs of a South Vietnamese Army Colonel's daughter, coming of age in America. And that can be
found on Amazon Kindle or paperback. And if you're in the Fresno area, it's available at Petunia's Place
bookstore. And it's an independent bookstore, and I highly recommend your support.
>> Okay, great, thank you. And is it "TigerFish," one word, or ->> Yes, thank you for pointing that out. It is one word.
>> So students, please get the book on Amazon if you can. Okay, great. What is your gender?
>> I identify as she.
>> What is your birth year? Not the date, birth year.
>> 1962.
>> What is your ethnic group and where were you born?
>> So I consider myself Vietnamese American. I was born in Nha Trang, South Vietnam.
>> What is your undergraduate major?
>> So I hold a Bachelor of Science degree in Industrial Technology at Fresno State.
>> Okay, what was your high school that you went to?
>> I'm proud to say I'm a Hoover High School Patriot.
>> Great! Okay, what generation are you in the United States? First, second, third?
>> I believe that I'm one-and-a-half generation.
>> Right.
>> I came over in -- when I was 13 years old.
>> Right, that's exactly 1.5, yes. What is your mother and father's highest education?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> So my mom didn't go very high. She graduated -- she completed or thereabout at elementary school.
Because of the wartime, she was not able to continue on. And my father, he graduated from the military
academy, so I think that's the equivalent of a Bachelor's.
>> Okay, what is your family composition, which means like what are -- how many brothers and sisters do
you have?
>> So I have five brothers and four sisters. And my two parents are still alive in Fresno.
>> Interesting. What was your GPA as undergraduate?
>> Well, I wish I could say it was higher, but it was 3.2, thereabout.
>> That's great, that's great. What was your ultimate degree aspiration? Was it B.A. or beyond that?
>> Well, you know, in the near future I might consider getting a higher degree. So far it's afforded me to
have a pretty happy lifestyle with my family, so -- but there's always the future. I'm not putting any sort of
limitation on it.
>> Inspiring. Your high school you said was Hoover?
>> Yes.
>> At the time that you went to Hoover, what was the ethnic racial makeup of that high school?
>> Well, I was -- it was mostly Caucasian, and some -- I can't break it down, but I would dare to say that
it's probably about 60 Caucasian, maybe 20 African American, you know. So where am I now? Sixty, right -no, 60, 20, so ->> Last 20%.
>> -- the rest are like Asian, but I would say Asian probably 2%.
>> Wow.
>> And there's only a handful of Vietnamese students. So we were the first wave into Fresno.
>> Interesting.
>> So there was only a handful of families.
>> Interesting, okay. Looking at the -- why -- looking at your college, why do Vietnamese people go to
college? Like why do -- why did you go to college? Why ->> Yeah, I think I could speak on my -- I mean, for me it was always that level of expectation and
standards. It's a given that we were going to go to college. There was no question. And we came from a
culture -- I want to say that Vietnam, when I was growing up we valued literature. And we value and highly
respect teachers and scholars. They -- their standing is where parents -- on the same level as parents or
sometimes higher. So we were taught in my school days to respect and revere not only our elders, but our
teachers, because they're the source of wisdom and the path to knowledge, and career, and ->> So why do Vietnamese not go to college?
>> Why don't Vietnamese go to college?
>> Yeah, why do they not go to college?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> In my own opinion -- it's my humble opinion -- it has a lot to do with parents' expectations. I never
questioned that. We always took what our parents said as gospel. So first of all, it's the parents' expectations
and family loyalty. So by not doing it would be to say, "I am," you know, "disagreeing with you and
disrespecting you." So for my own family that's the case. So I think that parents set the examples of role
modeling or expectations that, "This is what you're going to do." And then maybe the children would obey
and look at their example. So perhaps the expectations in some families, maybe that's not the focus. Maybe
that's not the high priority. So that's my humble opinion.
>> Okay, in relation to other Asians, why do Vietnamese Americans go to college less than let's say South
Asians who are at the 70% mark? Why is there a difference within the Asian groups?
>> Yeah, so again, this is what I've observed and talked to other South Asian friends, they -- again, it's their
parents' expectations. So they would say, "Either you're a lawyer or you're an engineer." There is not -seems like there's not like a lot of -- or doctors, right? So they don't give their kids options to fail or option to
do anything that's not professional. So again, the children do what's expected of them. And there's a lot of
that, again, family loyalty and deference. So I think South Asian friends that I know, they're successful
because of that. They do what their parents tell them to do. You know, that's just my opinion.
>> And what is your favorite subject? What's your least favorite subject?
>> Well, what's my favorite subject? I like to think that I'm both left- and right-brained. I love to data
crunch. I love -- so I was a GIS Chief for the Governor's Office of Emergency Services. So we ->> Oh, I ->> -- did a lot of data crunching. On the other hand, we do online mapping, so that's all visual. And so you
have artistic, and you have this scientific and technology-driven background. So I love to be able to
articulate ideas, information in a way that my readers can comprehend because, for example, if I produce a
map and -- for Emergency Services, if they looked at it, if they didn't get the information they need like
where's the evacuation route, where's the evacuation center, it's useless to them.
>> Right.
>> So I love subject matters that will allow me to analyze data, to synthesize it and visualize it in a way that
is useful for others, and therefore, provide useful information. So -- and I like to work with people. So
anything that would be helpful to, you know, younger generation or elderly populations. I think my heart is
in helping others.
>> What's your least favorite subject?
>> I would have to stay the statistics, even though I love ->> Oh!
>> Even though I love data crunching, with GIS we have tools, and we have programs to do it. I didn't have
to do it long-hand. In that class I had to do long-hand, and -- you know, most of the time -- and that was a
little bit tedious -- and economics. Otherwise, I love ->> Economics.
>> Yeah, so it's data-driven, but it's not -- I mean, one is long-hand, and the other one is not. You know, I
loved having the software to do it for me.
>> Okay, what makes a good professor for you to pass class?
>> That they care. I remember Calculus was one of the hardest classes that I had, but I loved it because I
had Dr. Ovakian [assumed spelling] at Fresno State, and he cared so much that I wanted to please him. By
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
caring, that means that, you know, when I go to his office hours, he made extra effort to explain it in a way
that I understand. He never minimized my concern. He never trivialized my concern. He never made me feel
like I'm any less than a male colleague. And he deeply cared. And you can see when somebody's just doing
just to get us off their back, or somebody who actually takes the time. And eye-to-eye, you know, heart-toheart, really want you to do well. And that carries a lot of weight.
>> Wow, okay. What makes a bad professor for you not to pass a class?
>> Make you feel stupid for asking a question, make you stay away. So for example, if you're -- I mean, I've
seen this, so in a chemistry class or something, teachers would tend to push away the kids who ask
questions, and sometimes girls. And I'd like to see that changed because then if we feel discouraged and we
feel disrespected, we're going to go somewhere else, right?
>> Right.
>> So please listen to your students. Please do not make them feel stupid for asking. If they show up, they
care. The ones who don't show up, then you should worry about those. But if they show up, give them their
time of day. They respect you enough to do that.
>> Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Have you ever been mentored in college?
>> Not in like an official way. I always -- I seek help, and I would go to office hours.
>> Great! That's great, you went to office hours.
>> I always -- yeah, I think ->> Tell the students, "Go to office hours." Yes.
>> Please make the time to -- and nowadays, you know, you can reach out by email, by phone call. You
have so many ways to reach your professors. Please do. In my day -- this is -- I graduated in 1984. So you
know, we didn't have that access to our teachers, so we'd lug our backpack all over campus, and we'd go to
our teachers for office hours. And make sure that you prepare for your teachers, because they have -- you
know, they have limited time, so have your questions, make it easy for your teachers to help you. You know,
that saying that, you know, "Help me help you," or you know, that kind of thing. Just -- or the reverse. But
anyway, you know, if you're asking for somebody -- asking somebody for help, make it easy for them, and
then they're more inclined to help you.
>> Great! I love that list of questions. That's awesome. What were the -- do you remember -- I think you
mentioned you didn't have any [inaudible] media depiction, so we're going to not use that question. What do
you -- do you think that your high school sufficiently prepared you for college? Your high school you went to,
Hoover?
>> So I would like to say yes, because I didn't feel overwhelmed my first semester in college. And it was a
really difficult cluster course. It was a 17-unit class -- or cluster course that had four-unit anthro, four-unit
biology, four geology, and then I believe two units of natural science. And we took field trips all over to -- it's
called Man in the Natural Environment. And it was a difficult cluster course. And I think my GPA didn't do
very well. But anyway, learned a lot. So don't get too hang up at first. You know, think about your study
skills. Think about habits. If you get into a habit of doing something, then you're almost there, because the
habit is what carries you day to day. So like you wouldn't forget to brush your teeth. So have a schedule,
have a study habit. If you ->> A routine, yeah.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Yeah, a routine, thank you. So if you feel like you need to brush up on your what is a study habits? What
-- how do I do it? I am sure there are resources on campus. Please take a class.
>> There are.
>> And understand what it means to manage your time, understand how to get help, understand how to
study, because studying, not everything is equal. You know, you could study and not be successful. So get
some help with how do I study for a test? Go ask your teacher. Go ask your professors, because they will
help you, because what you knew from high school -- especially if the high school has not prepared you well,
then you're at a loss. So go, make an appointment with your professor, and preface it with, "I need help how
to study for your test."
>> Excellent.
>> "How do I take notes for your class? What do -- where are your emphases? What are the takeaways that
you want me to have from your class?" Interview your teachers as those -- you know, like a job. Do you
want to succeed? Think of your college education as a stepping stone to make you successful in the
workplace. You want to do a job well. You want to learn your job description. So you go to your teachers
and say, "How -- I want to succeed in your class. What are some pointers that you can give me so I can get
everything that you want me to get out of your class?" And I'm sure if you ask that way in an email and then
follow up with a phone call or office visit, I'm sure they would work with you.
>> Okay, excellent. Those are great suggestions. So these are the optional questions, but do you think that
you had any barriers in higher education such as working, cultural, educational, financial, gender? Do you
think you had any barriers?
>> Yeah, you know, I think it's the same for everyone. We all have our doubts. So the bottom line is it's
intrinsic. So by that I mean that it has to come from you. So for example, I published a book. I did it for
myself. And no one could have told me, "Oh, you need to publish that book." I did it because I'm compelled
to do so, because I feel like my story no longer belongs to me, but belongs to the whole -- you know, the
bigger, global community. And there's messages there. So the takeaway is we all have challenges. We all
have problems. We all have financial. We have kids. We have, you know, illness in the family. You name it,
we're all faced with various degrees of challenges. So if it's something that's meaningful to you, grab onto it,
reach for the stars, keep your eyes on the prize. That's what I always tell my -- that's a good -- yeah,
because that's what I do. I keep my eyes on the prize. This is what I want, and nothing is going to stand in
my way.
>> But if students are listening and they're saying, "Well, but my mother makes me, you know, do the
dishes all day, and take care of my grandma, and watch kids, and that makes me miss class," you know,
what advice do you have? That sort of cultural advice?
>> Right, I ->> That's a big barrier we've found.
>> I ->> Or these males who have so much pressure.
>> Yeah, I -- that's a really good question. And so what I can say is I'm a Vietnamese American, and I was
raised with the same set of expectations. I remember having to do these chores before I would go take a
bus to school. Or I remember my parents got in a little tiff, and they want me to sit and be, you know, not
reconciled, but be a witness to that. And you know, that -- and I had to do it. I couldn't say, "I'm not
[inaudible]." So I lived through it. I get it. But there are times that you would have to do what you need to
do, but then think of yourself -- think that it's only a transient -- it's only a temporary state of affairs. You do
-- I mean, you do what you need to do. And sometimes you're going to have to say -- I know it's hard to say
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
no, but you have to take care of yourself first. I know that's really difficult. As an Asian, I know that we're
taught to be selfless. But you've got to keep it -- you know, instead of doing two hours of it, you're just
going to say, "I can do the other thing tomorrow." Put yourself first. I know it's very difficult, and I've been
through it, so I know exactly what you're saying. But I have to put myself first, because I'm thinking, "I want
to get out of poverty. I want to get out of" ->> Good point.
>> -- "the struggles." And so think long-term. Every one of us wants instant gratification. Every one of us
wants to have beautiful car, beautiful house, beautiful whatever. I'm just -- I'm right there with you. But it's
more important to me to have the education. It is a sustained way out of poverty, a sustained way to be
happy, because I know it will take longer, but when I achieve it and when I get my degree, you know, I
have a new sense of self-respect. I'm able to say no to people who -- that I wasn't able to say no before,
because now I have expectations that's placed on me, you know, by myself. And I'm -- I say, "Okay, I can
do this." And now it paves the way for other success. So I -- you know, think of it as temporary. And I don't
-- I'm not sure if I'm making sense, but ->> Oh, totally are.
>> Okay, okay.
>> It's very clear. So I think that especially the students who listen to you, they're going through the -- or
are going through what you went through, so they identify fully.
>> Yeah.
>> So the third and last part of the interview is actually success. You know, you area very rare person. You
are the very successful Southeast Asian. Can we talk about just you on a personal level? Why are you so
successful on a personal level? Like what is it about your personality? Why did you make it when so many -as we talked about earlier, so many people, you know, possibly didn't make it in terms of graduation? Why -how -- and your major is quite difficult -- and extremely difficult. And you're first-generation, so -- a 1.5, why
-- what is it -- can we talk about your -- peel your onion of your personality like?
>> So again, I couldn't speak enough about expectations. So I was born in the year of the tiger. And so in
our culture it's all -- the astrology, and the expectations, and the superstitions about a tiger woman or girl.
We're supposed to be very rebellious, very stubborn. We're undesirable as a woman to marry because we
buck the system. We are -- you know, so from day one -- well, I shouldn't say day one, I was a baby -- but
from very early on there's these expectations of me to be a difficult person.
>> Oh!
>> And so I learned to overcome challenges and difficulties. I've learned to overcome a lot of false
interpretation of myself. So I had to overcome -- so when people say, "Oh, well" -- you know, it's a funny
thing that the stigma of being a tiger girl -- I don't know about these days, but back in -- when I was
younger, it's kind of stayed with you. So because of that, I'm -- I was always kind of a fighter. So when
there are challenges or difficulties, I see that as I have to overcome. I have to prove everyone wrong.
>> Oh, interesting. And you were like this in third grade, sixth grade, and now?
>> And not only that, my dad was high-ranking -- he was a high-ranking officer, so my accomplishments
were always being vandalized or just misconstrued as, "Well, she's only getting good grades because she's
the Colonel's daughter," even though I worked very hard to get the good grades. And so there's always
these negative -- you know, negative stigma. So I've learned to just let it slide.
>> Interesting.
>> So how does that help others -- how does that even help other students? So my personality is you have
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
to be your own advocate. You have to be your own fighter.
>> Ooh!
>> Whatever it takes to stand up to bullies. I stood up to bullies when I first came to America. They wanted
to beat me up because they rifled through my purse, and I raised my hand, and I talked to the teacher. And
the teacher sent them to the principal. So they wanted to meet me after school to kick my butt. And you
know, I just reacted. I said, "I know karate." And that was it. The whole year they never bothered me again.
I was scared to death. I thought, "Oh, my gosh. Their boyfriends -- their scary boyfriend is going to beat me
up, too." But that never happened, so my point being that yes, I had challenges just like everyone else.
Some of us have harder times and, you know, have more difficult situations than I did. But here's the thing,
we need to stand up to the difficult situation. And I didn't have it good, either. I came over to America when
I was 13. My dad from -- going from being a Colonel to being a janitor for the church. And we all had, you
know, blue -- really manual labor jobs just so that we could get off welfare. We had so much pride that we
didn't want to, you know, stay on the welfare any more than we had to. So we got off of that because we
just took up there manual labor jobs. But that's -- we saw that as a family, it's a temporary situation. But
anyway, that's a family situation. Going back to me, what makes me different is that I -- again, I keep my
eyes on the prize. I know -- so I didn't leave Vietnam until I was 13. I understood and I valued the -- I
valued education. It had broadened my world. So back home during the summer I didn't have summer
camps. I didn't have all these luxuries that kids nowadays have in America. So what did I do? I read a lot of
books. So whatever money my parents gave me for good grades, I would go and spend money on books.
And I would read, and I would rent more books. So I -- that was my world. That was my escape. And I -you know, I drew with just pencil and paper. I drew with chalk on the board. So drawing, writing, and
reading, they were my coping skills. So when life -- when it got tough, that was where I went. So think
about ->> Thank you, that's a very good suggestion. Find coping skills, whatever your ->> Right.
>> Students have to find coping.
>> Yeah, and it doesn't have to be expensive. And another thing I love, and I have to share with you -- and
I didn't understand it until I met my husband -- so his family is all about Sierra Club, nature. And so they -as families, they would take family hikes to the Sierras ->> Oh!
>> -- outside of Fresno. So the kids grew up -- there's five kids in my husband's family -- they would take
these trips with other Sierra Club members. And I think that I would have to thank my husband and his
family for imparting that love of nature, because ->> Nature.
>> -- it is another way for me to cope with difficulties and to find solace. And that means that when there
are challenging situations, when I felt oppressed, when I felt like the world was against me, I would seek out
nature. And you know, you don't see a lot of people sitting on the park benches just to be. We don't do that
anymore as a society. So take time to reflect. And I am very introspective, meaning that I take a situation
that I was in, and I would reflect, and I would think about, "Okay, so this is what happened. How -- what
was my part in it? Could I do anything better? How could I have averted the confrontation? How could I
address people better?" So that is -- so to briefly tie it together, so I -- you know, I stand up for myself. I,
you know, keep my eyes on the prize. And you know, coping skills, again, they don't have to be expensive,
but take time to reflect. Take time to think about the situations. And learn to recognize -- you know, go read
some books and find out how to define your own boundaries, how to recognize when your boundaries is
being violated, how to stand up for yourself. Without these steps, you wouldn't understand how to stand up
for yourself, right? I mean, if you don't know what's wrong -- that's the most difficult thing is people don't
know what they don't know.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Right, that's a good point.
>> Yeah, and there's so much out there that we don't know. So by teaching yourself -- my dad taught
himself English. Right, he learned from the vinyls back in the day.
>> Oh, wow.
>> So he taught himself French as well, working with the French Army. So with the Internet, you could
really learn a lot of things like Open Culture. There's Khan Academy. There's so many open-source
educations.
>> That's great, too. That's great, too.
>> Yeah, and that's how -- actually what helped me with statistics was I went to Khan Academy.
>> Oh, okay!
>> And you go to YouTube. And you know, it will walk you through. So my best friend these days is Google.
I google everything. Not to give Google a plug, but really, you know, that's my research tool. And so when
you hear something, don't quickly -- especially these days, if you see something on the Internet, it -- just
because it says so, it doesn't mean that it's true. So be your own advocate. Research it. Heck, just go to
Snopes if like they're still in business. Just Snope [sic] it ->> What's a Snope?
>> Snopes? It's a ->> What is it?
>> -- S-N-O-P-E-S. It's Snopes.com. What they do is like -- it's like PoliticalFact.com. It's fact checking.
>> Oh, wow. That's great ->> Yeah, and it will ->> -- to know!
>> -- send you to the source. So then if you see something on the Internet, before you share it -- before I
share anything, I will Snope it. I will make sure that I'm spreading correct information. So that is something
that as an individual we need to be more responsible of sharing information because when you think about
it, it has impact farther and wider than you realize. So if you're spreading false information, not only it hurts
you. It hurts people in the community who you care deeply about. So why am I saying that? I'm saying that
because, you know, that's -- I feel like that helps me to be successful, because I don't -- I'm not easily
persuaded. I'm my own advocate, but I also advocate for the people who are voiceless, the people who are
marginalized, they feel oppressed, and they don't -- they can't for whatever reason stand up. And do it
because it's difficult. We don't want to be -- I know I've been told many times, "The nail that sticks out the
most is the one that gets pounded down." So most people do not want to stick out. Everybody, we all want
to ->> Very Asian talk -- well-known in Asia.
>> Yeah, and so we ->> Japanese.
>> -- want to homogenize. We want to harmonize. We don't want to stick out. And I get that, but there are
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
times when a person needs to stand out. For example, I feel like I've been lucky enough to have the tools I
need to have to be successful in America. It is on me. It is my moral obligation to impart what I know to
help others. I know that my situation is not like exactly like yours, whoever is listening, but it's not unique,
either. We all share that universal human experience. We all have struggles. So to go back to your question,
what makes -- you know, how did I come to this point? Acknowledge the people who help you, stay in the
community, and help others. Don't -- I try not to say, "I made it. Too bad, so sad for those of you who didn't
make it. And you're on your own. I am not that way anymore." To do everything I can to help others. So you
know, I even ask that the students I have at the author events at the high school, "Here's my email. Drop
me a line. As me any question you want to ask me, whether it's about writing, or about my refugee
experience, or my acculturation. Write me. I promise you I will return your email. It may take me a week. It
depends on what it is I'm doing, but I will return your email." So anyone who's listening, you can write me at
ChiSmith ->> Oh, my God!
>> -- ChiSmith@ChiBNChi.com [assumed spelling]. And like I said, you know, it depends on my workflow,
but if you have any questions, I really -- I feel like it's -- I want to help others to succeed. I remember what
it was like for me not to be able to speak a sentence. Or I can't even do my homework without looking up all
the words -- and I looked up a lot of words. So I do remember the challenges. I do remember the
discouraged feeling. I remember feeling depressed, and how I went from being very proficient in my
language and did really well to knowing nothing, like being a baby again. So I do remember that feeling. So
I want to reach out to those who are feeling discouraged to know that, you know, life is long. Think of it as a
continuum. And by that I mean don't think of things as black-and-white and binary, as success and failure.
There's many failures before you get to a success. So don't think of it as a failure. Think of it as steps that
you get -- you know, these are the stepping stones. Everything you do in life will help you with the next one.
Nothing goes to waste, nothing.
>> That's great.
>> Even your ->> Yeah.
>> If you even feel like, "Oh, my business didn't succeed." Well, for the next one you won't repeat the same
mistake, will you? I mean, so it builds -- it's like a pyramid. You know, you made a lot of mistakes down
here, and then you get to the pinnacle. Well, you got there because you did a lot of work. You can't go from
A to Z by skipping everything in between. You have to put in the physical work.
>> That's great advice, yeah.
>> So it's just -- surround yourself with people who are willing to help.
>> Yes, peers and mentors.
>> Yeah, it's not weak. Please do not equate seeking for help as being weak. It is not.
>> And ask questions.
>> Ask questions! You know what?
>> Ask for help, ask for help.
>> It's okay -- yeah, it's okay to ask for help because nobody knows everything. Remember that what I
said, "Nobody knows everything. No one." So there are experts in every field. They're there for a reason.
They know they learn -- if they don't know something, they'll -- I would hope that they'd be honest and say,
"I don't know that, but I'll help you look it up." And that -- so take comfort in knowing that it's not weak to
ask questions. I didn't get here on my own. Everything that -- you see successful people?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Right.
>> They didn't get there by themselves.
>> That's a great point. Very true.
>> They have ->> Many mentors.
>> Yeah, I mean, when you look at one successful person, they have a big community who has helped
propel them.
>> They're like on top of a mountain of people.
>> Yeah, and these are supporters. These are the people who believed in them. So make sure that you
reach out. And I know Fresno State would have resources for students to go get some help. So your first
point of contact might be your professor, and say, "Hey, I need help with," and they may -- you know, you
may not know what it is that you need help with. It's like I just said, you know, you don't know what you
don't know. And I've been there. So just start talking. And when you start talking, people can enumerate
what it is that they're hearing. And they'll feedback to you and say, "This is what I'm hearing. Am I right?"
And they would then help you find the resources. And I'm hoping that Fresno State would have the capacity
to have these bodies, or groups, or clubs that would help listen and tease out what it is that the students
might need, and then help them, you know, every step of the way to be successful. But please, I couldn't
say it enough. No one knows everything. Asking is not the same as being weak. You need to ask. And that's
why people are being paid. They went to school many years and get a lot of experience so that they can
help people like you and me. So take heart in knowing that even, you know -- who is it? -- Facebook or
Microsoft, I mean, those people have an army of folks who ->> Oh, Zuckerberg? Yeah.
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> Oh, please, yes!
>> So yeah, get help, by all means.
>> Excellent. Do you -- if we go back to your educational -- the bridges -- like I like to call it bridges, versus
the ->> Sure.
>> Do you remember any bridges that you used? So I hear that you used these bridges of mentors. I hear
that you use these bridges of getting help.
>> Yeah.
>> Were there any like cultural, educational, financial, structural, health, community health bridges? Did you
have any of those?
>> In college?
>> Yeah.
>> So -- okay, so in college, again, I was -- I'm -- I was really big on getting help from the professor. So
whatever I needed, I would go to the professor and ask them for help. And they were pretty good to, you
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
know, help me with the subject matter. I didn't get help with cultural -- like with my acculturation. I didn't
reach out to anybody like that.
>> Did you do any clubs on campus at all? Like did you -- wasn't it Dr. Picasso Howard ->> Dr. -- yeah. You know, I was not really ->> Dr. -- is it Katsu [assumed spelling] Howard?
>> You know, I don't think that I was really involved with a lot of clubs. I was very studious. I pretty much
stayed with just the teachers. And I'm trying to think -- I don't think I did a lot of clubs.
>> But did you -- how do you know Dr. Ng?
>> Oh, how do I know Dr. Ng? Just -- I didn't take a class from him. Like, you know, my husband took a
class from him.
>> Oh, okay.
>> And I think my husband introduced me to him. And then, of course, my siblings all took classes from Dr.
Ng. And so ->> Ah!
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> Okay.
>> So that's how we knew each other. But so I'm going to go down the list. So did I have mentors? So I
didn't have mentors, but when there are people who I respect, like the teachers I loved and respect, I would
go to listen to them. I would look at them and I'd say, "Why is it I love this teacher so much? What are they
actually" ->> So you analyze them?
>> I do analyze them.
>> You analyze them.
>> So that's the part of me I guess I -- maybe that's why I'm an author. I observe people. And then I
dissect what is it about this person that I admire? The people who I admire, they listen. It's not about them,
right? They would listen to you or whomever, and they remember. And then the next time you see them
they'll ask, "So what about that subject matter that you were telling me?" Then that person feels so valued
because you're being listened to. So I -- and it's all about -- the people I respect, and really adore, and you
know, they are my mentor, even though they didn't know it -- so I look at them, "Okay, I'd love to be like
this." So then I would -- when I talk to other people, I want to pay attention to them. I want to give them
my undivided attention and ask about them, because most people want to tell you about themselves. This is
their way of saying ->> Right.
>> -- if -- you know, "Do you value me?" You know, if -- because your time is the most valuable resource,
correct?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> So if you give somebody your time and attention, they feel loved. They feel respected. They feel heard.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
And so I look at those people as my mentors. And these are the people --so I -- when they -- and then when
it's their turn to talk, they talk about -- they don't talk about themselves. They talk about others. And they
talk about things that are interesting to me. They talk about subject matters that I'm interested in, like -- I
don't know -- anthropology, or stars, or whatever the subject matter, or talk about books. So interesting
people -- the people who taught me a lot taught me how to love others, right, how to listen to others,
because when you do that, I think that it gives you -- there's a lot of rewards that come back to you, instead
of saying, "It's all about me." People actually -- like being an author, or talk about whenever I do some
presentation, people don't really care about who I am, honestly. People want to know what it is that they
can learn from me.
>> Right, yeah!
>> Isn't that true?
>> Yes.
>> So what are some values that you can bring to the table? People want to have your takeaway. They
don't care that I had two eggs for breakfast. That's not helpful to them. So those are the mentors I have.
And so I don't really have official mentors. I just kind of grab on or gravitate toward the people who have a
lot to give, you know, take away the values. So those of us who have gone through a lot of challenges -- life
challenges, and refugees, and immigrants, or whatever, we have our -- you know, we all have such difficult
situation that we think nobody cares, nobody would understand, nobody can relate. Well, guess what?
There's a lot of us have gone through a lot of things that you -- maybe not all of it, but we probably
understand some of what you've gone through, some of what you suffer. And so let's verbalize the suffering.
Your suffering could be teaching moments for others. And it allows others to understand us more. So then
the more understanding we have of each other, the more we can give each other. And really it's not a sumzero gain. Just because you succeed doesn't mean that I can't succeed. Right, it's not a piece of -- it's not a
pie. So let's help each other. Let's elevate each other. If I can help you to succeed, I'm happy to do it. And
then you pay it forward. So in the author community, in the short time that I'm in, other authors help me
and I help them, and the consensus is that we don't want anything in return, just pay it forward.
>> Yeah.
>> So my job is to pay it forward. My job is to help others. And I -- it's very fulfilling because when you help
others, it really comes back in a most unexpected way. So I think I -- I think ->> Yeah, that's a great description. So the last part then is -- yes or no, smaller classes? Would you like
smaller classes?
>> Anthropology?
>> The whole, entire school. Or no difference? Yes, no, or?
>> Yes.
>> More co-ethnic professors?
>> More?
>> More Asian, co-ethnic professors?
>> I don't know that that's -- oh, yes or no?
>> Yeah.
>> Yes.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Or -- okay. What about more Asian classmates?
>> No.
>> More Asian ethnic clubs?
>> I'll say yes, but I'd like to expound on ->> Okay.
>> So form my personal experience, the reason why I hesitate to say anything so black and white, because
I didn't have a lot of -- if -- you don't want to give people too many crutches. You want to give them
resources, yes. I'm not against that. By all means, give students resources to be successful. But at the same
time, not to -- if you raise an expectation, they'll come up to meet you with the tools that you give them.
Does that make sense?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> But you don't want to baby them too much or coddle the students too much. So there's the extremes, so
you know, doing too much and doing too little. So I think it's helpful to have our ethnic group represented.
That I agree with, because if you don't -- if we don't have role models in our own ethnic groups to speak
and understand our challenges or difficulties, then it's harder to overcome these challenges. You know, I'm
thinking back in my situation, I didn't have people to hold my hands. And so you know, it's very individual.
Some people challenge themselves to overcome these difficulties, and some people need a little bit more
help. So I think let's err on the side of giving people help ->> Okay.
>> -- and have them identify with the role models that they -- that get their ethnicity.
>> Okay, the penultimate -- second-to-the-last question -- and the last question is actually -- I'll ask later,
the advice to their generation, but what workshops -- college success workshops do you want to see at
Fresno State?
>> Workshops? So form my personal experience, I think as refugees and immigrants we're thrown into a
sink-or-swim mode, survival mode. And so we never had the opportunity to adequately go through the
grieving process. And by that I mean -- I'll break into different groups. So the refugee like myself, we're
thrown over -- I mean, yes, we escape and -- persecution, and so we have life, and liberty, and freedom.
And that's all good. So we have the survival skills where we feel like, you know, we made it over here. Who
are we? What gave us the right to even feel any grief, you know? We should be so lucky -- we should feel so
lucky. So we just march on, stiff upper lip, not even addressing any kind of grief. When you shed your
identity, cultural, social, all of the identity that you -- that makes you who you are -- I was 13. I came over
here, just march on, and never given an opportunity or to have any resources to deal with your grief, right.
And there's so many stages of grief. We just march on. And I think that it kind of backfired on me. When I
was in my 30s, after I had my kids and everything, and when things kind of start settling down, because
now I have my career. I have kids, I'm married, and do pretty well socially. Then you start to think about -you have that -- what's the word? -- Existential question. You know, you question about, okay, who I am?
Why am I here? You know, what value do I have to offer to others? You know, so all of those things. When
the dust settles, then your grief manifests itself in a way that it hits you. It hits you pretty hard, when you
least expect it. Grief is funny that way. And so how do you cope with that? And for me, at that time I turned
to reading, and I -- and it's -- I read a lot of Thich Nhat Hanh. He's a Vietnamese Buddhist Zen teacher.
>> Oh, okay.
>> So Thich Nhat Hanh is -- he's very well-known in the American literature.
>> How do you spell that, to the students?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> So -- T-H-I-C-H, is one word. Nhat is N-H-A-T. And then the last word is H-A-N-H.
>> Okay, so you can google it. They're going to google it.
>> Yeah, he's written many -- but the one -- one of the ones that I read and helped me was Something
Christian and something Buddha. I don't remember, but anyway, he has many, and really helped me deal
with my identity crisis. And I think that's what it was is that I didn't -- I couldn't really place myself
anywhere. You know, I'm not quite American. I'm not quite Vietnamese. I've been straddling between two
cultures. I've been doing pretty much the co-switching between the traditional Vietnamese Eastern, trying to
fit in, trying to please my parents, and you know, be respecting the Vietnamese community. And then, of
course, do well in American society. So that identity crisis, those -- so books really are what I turned to. And
so, again, I couldn't stress enough with go with some coping skills that's not destructive. So go with books,
and go take walks, go swim, bike, whatever it is you do. You know, give these things a chance. And anything
that would expand some energy -- so you get this endorphin afterward, and you feel good about yourself. So
do something -- some physical activity so that, first of all, it gives -- it makes you immediately physically feel
good about yourself so that you can then deal with the mental part, the psychological part. And earlier on, I
was just saying when times are tough, like I said, you know, I write, I read, I draw. But the other thing that
I do -- and that's thanks to Thich Nhat Hanh -- I think of my -- I thought of myself as a baby. I envision
myself as a child, this helpless child. And whatever it was that I felt like it was -- I was missing out of my
childhood, whether it's a misperception on my part of whatever it was, this is my perception, wherever that I
was lacking or whatever I was feeling, I am now a separate self, and I'm an adult. I'm a capable adult. I'm
going to help bring that child and give that child everything that child needs to transition successfully to be
an adult. So how did I do that? I just look at these pictures of myself, which is a mental picture. And so say
if I didn't feel like I was loved enough or whatever -- whatever the case might be, I would talk to myself and
say -- you know, what I -- whatever I tell -- you know, just love and embrace that child that was you, and
bring that child along. And I think that that really helped me. Again, this was in my 30s when I had this
identity crisis. And you know, it really helped [inaudible] do something that betters yourself, and not a
destructive -- anything destructive that only helps you in the moment, but not long-term. So respect your
body.
>> That is excellent advice.
>> Yeah, respect your body.
>> So the last question -- and I think you kind of answered a lot of that with your other comments.
>> Yeah, in a round-about way.
>> But in six years we're going to have a third generation. They're coming in. The first wave of thirdgeneration. Later on, fourth. What advice do you have? You know, right now people predominantly will listen
to the second generation. What will -- what advice do you have for the second and third -- that's going to be
in six years -- what advice do you have for them to be successful? I feel like you said a lot already, but
they're coming in, and they'll have second-generation parents, and third -- first-generation grandparents.
What advice do you have for them ->> Yeah, so what I'm hearing ->> -- to graduate?
>> Yeah, so the biggest thing for Asian Americans is that we have so much of the family loyalty and respect,
and we're taught to listen to our parents and never question them, never -- we're not supposed to question
or say no to anything. But here's one thing that I have to say, at some point in our lives, we have to learn
about our boundaries and say, "I love you. And I respect you. But I need to do this to get myself in a place
where I'm a happy individual." I know that's difficult for me to even say that to my parents, but at one point
I did.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Oh, wow!
>> Yeah. Well, I did it with a letter first.
>> Okay, what -- goodness.
>> Yeah, so I wrote a letter to my dad, and he actually wrote me back.
>> Oh, wow!
>> So if you can't do that verbally, then do it in a letter. And I know that not all parents will be open to that,
but in your own way -- I do get it. I'm not minimalized, you know, your loyalty to your family if you can't
bring yourself to say that. I completely get it. But in your own way, somehow -- you know, we really need to
put our foot down and say, "I need to do this for myself. If I'm going to get myself out of whatever situation
I'm unhappy with, I am the only one who can actually help myself," right?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> Because if we don't recognize that there's something that is holding us back -- it starts with us, and if we
don't do it for us, nobody is going to come along and do it for us. I mean, in this country, it's all about civil
liberty. You know, you can't tell somebody what to do. We can only encourage them. So I know that that's
probably not helpful, but just learn about your position and your boundary. And think about where you want
to be five years from now, 10 years from now. Visualize what you want to achieve, and then work backward.
And say, "Okay, if I want to be a business owner, how do I do that? Well, do I need a business degree? Do I
need to intern and watch how other people do it? Take lessons from them? What do I need to get there?"
But let's project and see ourselves first. Is that person that you see, is that somebody that you respect?
Right, so that's what I would say to the third generation is hopefully that they would be able to, you know,
do some research for themselves, see -- you know, visualize who they want to become, work backward, and
get help. For goodness sake, get some help.
>> Yes, ask for help. Yes. Ask for help.
>> When I say help, I don't mean it in a demeaning way. We all -- think of it as ->> We all need help, yeah.
>> Yeah, so consultants. There's so many consultants, they make money doing consulting. Do you think
that these consultants work for people who -- you know, these will be successful people, because they how
they get consulting ideas, because we're into ourselves so much we're subjective. We don't see ourselves in
the way that is fair to us. So if we get other so listen to our situation, they can tease it out, and they can
say, "Oh, you want to be such-and-such in five years? Here's the -- here's a roadmap." You wouldn't plan to
go to L.A. without a roadmap, so why would you plan your life without a roadmap?
>> That's brilliant.
>> Yeah.
>> That's definitely brilliant.
>> So maybe that would be helpful.
>> Very.
>> Believe in yourself and advocate for yourself. Don't let others advocate for you. They don't know -- you
are your boss. And so I hope that that has helped.
>> Yeah, that is awesome advice for like your daughter's children.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Yeah, definitely. Just shoot -- I mean, really aim high. If we aim so low, it won't take much for us to
succeed. So set your standards high. And because when you're doing that, you're giving yourself respect. So
love and respect are drawn -- are attracted to us when people see that we're kind, thoughtful, and -- you
know, that's how people are drawn to you. And do it because -- for yourself, not because of all the side
effects. But when you're confident, and self-loving, and self-respecting, others will come to love and respect
you, because if you don't respect yourself, people are just going to say, "Ah, well, that's not somebody who I
want to be with -- around," right? So, yeah, that would be something that I would leave you with.
>> Definitely. Okay, all right. Well, thank you so much. Let me turn off the thing. You gave great --
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
interviewed for a new archive at Fresno State University called Successful Southeast Asians. If you can
please state your name and spell it.
>> Hi, everyone. My name is Hoang Chi Truong Smith. And Hoang Chi is spelled HO-A-N-G, C-H-I. My
maiden name is T-R-U-O-N-G. And my married name is Smith, S-M-I-T-H.
>> Thank you, Ms. Chi. If you can actually give me verbal permission to interview you for our new
Successful Southeast Asian archive.
>> Yes, it's my pleasure. I do give you permission.
>> Great, and also you might want to mention the book that you wrote so the students can go buy your
book.
>> Yeah, absolutely. I'm happy to announce the recently-published book. It's called, "TigerFish," one word.
It's the memoirs of a South Vietnamese Army Colonel's daughter, coming of age in America. And that can be
found on Amazon Kindle or paperback. And if you're in the Fresno area, it's available at Petunia's Place
bookstore. And it's an independent bookstore, and I highly recommend your support.
>> Okay, great, thank you. And is it "TigerFish," one word, or ->> Yes, thank you for pointing that out. It is one word.
>> So students, please get the book on Amazon if you can. Okay, great. What is your gender?
>> I identify as she.
>> What is your birth year? Not the date, birth year.
>> 1962.
>> What is your ethnic group and where were you born?
>> So I consider myself Vietnamese American. I was born in Nha Trang, South Vietnam.
>> What is your undergraduate major?
>> So I hold a Bachelor of Science degree in Industrial Technology at Fresno State.
>> Okay, what was your high school that you went to?
>> I'm proud to say I'm a Hoover High School Patriot.
>> Great! Okay, what generation are you in the United States? First, second, third?
>> I believe that I'm one-and-a-half generation.
>> Right.
>> I came over in -- when I was 13 years old.
>> Right, that's exactly 1.5, yes. What is your mother and father's highest education?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> So my mom didn't go very high. She graduated -- she completed or thereabout at elementary school.
Because of the wartime, she was not able to continue on. And my father, he graduated from the military
academy, so I think that's the equivalent of a Bachelor's.
>> Okay, what is your family composition, which means like what are -- how many brothers and sisters do
you have?
>> So I have five brothers and four sisters. And my two parents are still alive in Fresno.
>> Interesting. What was your GPA as undergraduate?
>> Well, I wish I could say it was higher, but it was 3.2, thereabout.
>> That's great, that's great. What was your ultimate degree aspiration? Was it B.A. or beyond that?
>> Well, you know, in the near future I might consider getting a higher degree. So far it's afforded me to
have a pretty happy lifestyle with my family, so -- but there's always the future. I'm not putting any sort of
limitation on it.
>> Inspiring. Your high school you said was Hoover?
>> Yes.
>> At the time that you went to Hoover, what was the ethnic racial makeup of that high school?
>> Well, I was -- it was mostly Caucasian, and some -- I can't break it down, but I would dare to say that
it's probably about 60 Caucasian, maybe 20 African American, you know. So where am I now? Sixty, right -no, 60, 20, so ->> Last 20%.
>> -- the rest are like Asian, but I would say Asian probably 2%.
>> Wow.
>> And there's only a handful of Vietnamese students. So we were the first wave into Fresno.
>> Interesting.
>> So there was only a handful of families.
>> Interesting, okay. Looking at the -- why -- looking at your college, why do Vietnamese people go to
college? Like why do -- why did you go to college? Why ->> Yeah, I think I could speak on my -- I mean, for me it was always that level of expectation and
standards. It's a given that we were going to go to college. There was no question. And we came from a
culture -- I want to say that Vietnam, when I was growing up we valued literature. And we value and highly
respect teachers and scholars. They -- their standing is where parents -- on the same level as parents or
sometimes higher. So we were taught in my school days to respect and revere not only our elders, but our
teachers, because they're the source of wisdom and the path to knowledge, and career, and ->> So why do Vietnamese not go to college?
>> Why don't Vietnamese go to college?
>> Yeah, why do they not go to college?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> In my own opinion -- it's my humble opinion -- it has a lot to do with parents' expectations. I never
questioned that. We always took what our parents said as gospel. So first of all, it's the parents' expectations
and family loyalty. So by not doing it would be to say, "I am," you know, "disagreeing with you and
disrespecting you." So for my own family that's the case. So I think that parents set the examples of role
modeling or expectations that, "This is what you're going to do." And then maybe the children would obey
and look at their example. So perhaps the expectations in some families, maybe that's not the focus. Maybe
that's not the high priority. So that's my humble opinion.
>> Okay, in relation to other Asians, why do Vietnamese Americans go to college less than let's say South
Asians who are at the 70% mark? Why is there a difference within the Asian groups?
>> Yeah, so again, this is what I've observed and talked to other South Asian friends, they -- again, it's their
parents' expectations. So they would say, "Either you're a lawyer or you're an engineer." There is not -seems like there's not like a lot of -- or doctors, right? So they don't give their kids options to fail or option to
do anything that's not professional. So again, the children do what's expected of them. And there's a lot of
that, again, family loyalty and deference. So I think South Asian friends that I know, they're successful
because of that. They do what their parents tell them to do. You know, that's just my opinion.
>> And what is your favorite subject? What's your least favorite subject?
>> Well, what's my favorite subject? I like to think that I'm both left- and right-brained. I love to data
crunch. I love -- so I was a GIS Chief for the Governor's Office of Emergency Services. So we ->> Oh, I ->> -- did a lot of data crunching. On the other hand, we do online mapping, so that's all visual. And so you
have artistic, and you have this scientific and technology-driven background. So I love to be able to
articulate ideas, information in a way that my readers can comprehend because, for example, if I produce a
map and -- for Emergency Services, if they looked at it, if they didn't get the information they need like
where's the evacuation route, where's the evacuation center, it's useless to them.
>> Right.
>> So I love subject matters that will allow me to analyze data, to synthesize it and visualize it in a way that
is useful for others, and therefore, provide useful information. So -- and I like to work with people. So
anything that would be helpful to, you know, younger generation or elderly populations. I think my heart is
in helping others.
>> What's your least favorite subject?
>> I would have to stay the statistics, even though I love ->> Oh!
>> Even though I love data crunching, with GIS we have tools, and we have programs to do it. I didn't have
to do it long-hand. In that class I had to do long-hand, and -- you know, most of the time -- and that was a
little bit tedious -- and economics. Otherwise, I love ->> Economics.
>> Yeah, so it's data-driven, but it's not -- I mean, one is long-hand, and the other one is not. You know, I
loved having the software to do it for me.
>> Okay, what makes a good professor for you to pass class?
>> That they care. I remember Calculus was one of the hardest classes that I had, but I loved it because I
had Dr. Ovakian [assumed spelling] at Fresno State, and he cared so much that I wanted to please him. By
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
caring, that means that, you know, when I go to his office hours, he made extra effort to explain it in a way
that I understand. He never minimized my concern. He never trivialized my concern. He never made me feel
like I'm any less than a male colleague. And he deeply cared. And you can see when somebody's just doing
just to get us off their back, or somebody who actually takes the time. And eye-to-eye, you know, heart-toheart, really want you to do well. And that carries a lot of weight.
>> Wow, okay. What makes a bad professor for you not to pass a class?
>> Make you feel stupid for asking a question, make you stay away. So for example, if you're -- I mean, I've
seen this, so in a chemistry class or something, teachers would tend to push away the kids who ask
questions, and sometimes girls. And I'd like to see that changed because then if we feel discouraged and we
feel disrespected, we're going to go somewhere else, right?
>> Right.
>> So please listen to your students. Please do not make them feel stupid for asking. If they show up, they
care. The ones who don't show up, then you should worry about those. But if they show up, give them their
time of day. They respect you enough to do that.
>> Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Have you ever been mentored in college?
>> Not in like an official way. I always -- I seek help, and I would go to office hours.
>> Great! That's great, you went to office hours.
>> I always -- yeah, I think ->> Tell the students, "Go to office hours." Yes.
>> Please make the time to -- and nowadays, you know, you can reach out by email, by phone call. You
have so many ways to reach your professors. Please do. In my day -- this is -- I graduated in 1984. So you
know, we didn't have that access to our teachers, so we'd lug our backpack all over campus, and we'd go to
our teachers for office hours. And make sure that you prepare for your teachers, because they have -- you
know, they have limited time, so have your questions, make it easy for your teachers to help you. You know,
that saying that, you know, "Help me help you," or you know, that kind of thing. Just -- or the reverse. But
anyway, you know, if you're asking for somebody -- asking somebody for help, make it easy for them, and
then they're more inclined to help you.
>> Great! I love that list of questions. That's awesome. What were the -- do you remember -- I think you
mentioned you didn't have any [inaudible] media depiction, so we're going to not use that question. What do
you -- do you think that your high school sufficiently prepared you for college? Your high school you went to,
Hoover?
>> So I would like to say yes, because I didn't feel overwhelmed my first semester in college. And it was a
really difficult cluster course. It was a 17-unit class -- or cluster course that had four-unit anthro, four-unit
biology, four geology, and then I believe two units of natural science. And we took field trips all over to -- it's
called Man in the Natural Environment. And it was a difficult cluster course. And I think my GPA didn't do
very well. But anyway, learned a lot. So don't get too hang up at first. You know, think about your study
skills. Think about habits. If you get into a habit of doing something, then you're almost there, because the
habit is what carries you day to day. So like you wouldn't forget to brush your teeth. So have a schedule,
have a study habit. If you ->> A routine, yeah.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Yeah, a routine, thank you. So if you feel like you need to brush up on your what is a study habits? What
-- how do I do it? I am sure there are resources on campus. Please take a class.
>> There are.
>> And understand what it means to manage your time, understand how to get help, understand how to
study, because studying, not everything is equal. You know, you could study and not be successful. So get
some help with how do I study for a test? Go ask your teacher. Go ask your professors, because they will
help you, because what you knew from high school -- especially if the high school has not prepared you well,
then you're at a loss. So go, make an appointment with your professor, and preface it with, "I need help how
to study for your test."
>> Excellent.
>> "How do I take notes for your class? What do -- where are your emphases? What are the takeaways that
you want me to have from your class?" Interview your teachers as those -- you know, like a job. Do you
want to succeed? Think of your college education as a stepping stone to make you successful in the
workplace. You want to do a job well. You want to learn your job description. So you go to your teachers
and say, "How -- I want to succeed in your class. What are some pointers that you can give me so I can get
everything that you want me to get out of your class?" And I'm sure if you ask that way in an email and then
follow up with a phone call or office visit, I'm sure they would work with you.
>> Okay, excellent. Those are great suggestions. So these are the optional questions, but do you think that
you had any barriers in higher education such as working, cultural, educational, financial, gender? Do you
think you had any barriers?
>> Yeah, you know, I think it's the same for everyone. We all have our doubts. So the bottom line is it's
intrinsic. So by that I mean that it has to come from you. So for example, I published a book. I did it for
myself. And no one could have told me, "Oh, you need to publish that book." I did it because I'm compelled
to do so, because I feel like my story no longer belongs to me, but belongs to the whole -- you know, the
bigger, global community. And there's messages there. So the takeaway is we all have challenges. We all
have problems. We all have financial. We have kids. We have, you know, illness in the family. You name it,
we're all faced with various degrees of challenges. So if it's something that's meaningful to you, grab onto it,
reach for the stars, keep your eyes on the prize. That's what I always tell my -- that's a good -- yeah,
because that's what I do. I keep my eyes on the prize. This is what I want, and nothing is going to stand in
my way.
>> But if students are listening and they're saying, "Well, but my mother makes me, you know, do the
dishes all day, and take care of my grandma, and watch kids, and that makes me miss class," you know,
what advice do you have? That sort of cultural advice?
>> Right, I ->> That's a big barrier we've found.
>> I ->> Or these males who have so much pressure.
>> Yeah, I -- that's a really good question. And so what I can say is I'm a Vietnamese American, and I was
raised with the same set of expectations. I remember having to do these chores before I would go take a
bus to school. Or I remember my parents got in a little tiff, and they want me to sit and be, you know, not
reconciled, but be a witness to that. And you know, that -- and I had to do it. I couldn't say, "I'm not
[inaudible]." So I lived through it. I get it. But there are times that you would have to do what you need to
do, but then think of yourself -- think that it's only a transient -- it's only a temporary state of affairs. You do
-- I mean, you do what you need to do. And sometimes you're going to have to say -- I know it's hard to say
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
no, but you have to take care of yourself first. I know that's really difficult. As an Asian, I know that we're
taught to be selfless. But you've got to keep it -- you know, instead of doing two hours of it, you're just
going to say, "I can do the other thing tomorrow." Put yourself first. I know it's very difficult, and I've been
through it, so I know exactly what you're saying. But I have to put myself first, because I'm thinking, "I want
to get out of poverty. I want to get out of" ->> Good point.
>> -- "the struggles." And so think long-term. Every one of us wants instant gratification. Every one of us
wants to have beautiful car, beautiful house, beautiful whatever. I'm just -- I'm right there with you. But it's
more important to me to have the education. It is a sustained way out of poverty, a sustained way to be
happy, because I know it will take longer, but when I achieve it and when I get my degree, you know, I
have a new sense of self-respect. I'm able to say no to people who -- that I wasn't able to say no before,
because now I have expectations that's placed on me, you know, by myself. And I'm -- I say, "Okay, I can
do this." And now it paves the way for other success. So I -- you know, think of it as temporary. And I don't
-- I'm not sure if I'm making sense, but ->> Oh, totally are.
>> Okay, okay.
>> It's very clear. So I think that especially the students who listen to you, they're going through the -- or
are going through what you went through, so they identify fully.
>> Yeah.
>> So the third and last part of the interview is actually success. You know, you area very rare person. You
are the very successful Southeast Asian. Can we talk about just you on a personal level? Why are you so
successful on a personal level? Like what is it about your personality? Why did you make it when so many -as we talked about earlier, so many people, you know, possibly didn't make it in terms of graduation? Why -how -- and your major is quite difficult -- and extremely difficult. And you're first-generation, so -- a 1.5, why
-- what is it -- can we talk about your -- peel your onion of your personality like?
>> So again, I couldn't speak enough about expectations. So I was born in the year of the tiger. And so in
our culture it's all -- the astrology, and the expectations, and the superstitions about a tiger woman or girl.
We're supposed to be very rebellious, very stubborn. We're undesirable as a woman to marry because we
buck the system. We are -- you know, so from day one -- well, I shouldn't say day one, I was a baby -- but
from very early on there's these expectations of me to be a difficult person.
>> Oh!
>> And so I learned to overcome challenges and difficulties. I've learned to overcome a lot of false
interpretation of myself. So I had to overcome -- so when people say, "Oh, well" -- you know, it's a funny
thing that the stigma of being a tiger girl -- I don't know about these days, but back in -- when I was
younger, it's kind of stayed with you. So because of that, I'm -- I was always kind of a fighter. So when
there are challenges or difficulties, I see that as I have to overcome. I have to prove everyone wrong.
>> Oh, interesting. And you were like this in third grade, sixth grade, and now?
>> And not only that, my dad was high-ranking -- he was a high-ranking officer, so my accomplishments
were always being vandalized or just misconstrued as, "Well, she's only getting good grades because she's
the Colonel's daughter," even though I worked very hard to get the good grades. And so there's always
these negative -- you know, negative stigma. So I've learned to just let it slide.
>> Interesting.
>> So how does that help others -- how does that even help other students? So my personality is you have
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
to be your own advocate. You have to be your own fighter.
>> Ooh!
>> Whatever it takes to stand up to bullies. I stood up to bullies when I first came to America. They wanted
to beat me up because they rifled through my purse, and I raised my hand, and I talked to the teacher. And
the teacher sent them to the principal. So they wanted to meet me after school to kick my butt. And you
know, I just reacted. I said, "I know karate." And that was it. The whole year they never bothered me again.
I was scared to death. I thought, "Oh, my gosh. Their boyfriends -- their scary boyfriend is going to beat me
up, too." But that never happened, so my point being that yes, I had challenges just like everyone else.
Some of us have harder times and, you know, have more difficult situations than I did. But here's the thing,
we need to stand up to the difficult situation. And I didn't have it good, either. I came over to America when
I was 13. My dad from -- going from being a Colonel to being a janitor for the church. And we all had, you
know, blue -- really manual labor jobs just so that we could get off welfare. We had so much pride that we
didn't want to, you know, stay on the welfare any more than we had to. So we got off of that because we
just took up there manual labor jobs. But that's -- we saw that as a family, it's a temporary situation. But
anyway, that's a family situation. Going back to me, what makes me different is that I -- again, I keep my
eyes on the prize. I know -- so I didn't leave Vietnam until I was 13. I understood and I valued the -- I
valued education. It had broadened my world. So back home during the summer I didn't have summer
camps. I didn't have all these luxuries that kids nowadays have in America. So what did I do? I read a lot of
books. So whatever money my parents gave me for good grades, I would go and spend money on books.
And I would read, and I would rent more books. So I -- that was my world. That was my escape. And I -you know, I drew with just pencil and paper. I drew with chalk on the board. So drawing, writing, and
reading, they were my coping skills. So when life -- when it got tough, that was where I went. So think
about ->> Thank you, that's a very good suggestion. Find coping skills, whatever your ->> Right.
>> Students have to find coping.
>> Yeah, and it doesn't have to be expensive. And another thing I love, and I have to share with you -- and
I didn't understand it until I met my husband -- so his family is all about Sierra Club, nature. And so they -as families, they would take family hikes to the Sierras ->> Oh!
>> -- outside of Fresno. So the kids grew up -- there's five kids in my husband's family -- they would take
these trips with other Sierra Club members. And I think that I would have to thank my husband and his
family for imparting that love of nature, because ->> Nature.
>> -- it is another way for me to cope with difficulties and to find solace. And that means that when there
are challenging situations, when I felt oppressed, when I felt like the world was against me, I would seek out
nature. And you know, you don't see a lot of people sitting on the park benches just to be. We don't do that
anymore as a society. So take time to reflect. And I am very introspective, meaning that I take a situation
that I was in, and I would reflect, and I would think about, "Okay, so this is what happened. How -- what
was my part in it? Could I do anything better? How could I have averted the confrontation? How could I
address people better?" So that is -- so to briefly tie it together, so I -- you know, I stand up for myself. I,
you know, keep my eyes on the prize. And you know, coping skills, again, they don't have to be expensive,
but take time to reflect. Take time to think about the situations. And learn to recognize -- you know, go read
some books and find out how to define your own boundaries, how to recognize when your boundaries is
being violated, how to stand up for yourself. Without these steps, you wouldn't understand how to stand up
for yourself, right? I mean, if you don't know what's wrong -- that's the most difficult thing is people don't
know what they don't know.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Right, that's a good point.
>> Yeah, and there's so much out there that we don't know. So by teaching yourself -- my dad taught
himself English. Right, he learned from the vinyls back in the day.
>> Oh, wow.
>> So he taught himself French as well, working with the French Army. So with the Internet, you could
really learn a lot of things like Open Culture. There's Khan Academy. There's so many open-source
educations.
>> That's great, too. That's great, too.
>> Yeah, and that's how -- actually what helped me with statistics was I went to Khan Academy.
>> Oh, okay!
>> And you go to YouTube. And you know, it will walk you through. So my best friend these days is Google.
I google everything. Not to give Google a plug, but really, you know, that's my research tool. And so when
you hear something, don't quickly -- especially these days, if you see something on the Internet, it -- just
because it says so, it doesn't mean that it's true. So be your own advocate. Research it. Heck, just go to
Snopes if like they're still in business. Just Snope [sic] it ->> What's a Snope?
>> Snopes? It's a ->> What is it?
>> -- S-N-O-P-E-S. It's Snopes.com. What they do is like -- it's like PoliticalFact.com. It's fact checking.
>> Oh, wow. That's great ->> Yeah, and it will ->> -- to know!
>> -- send you to the source. So then if you see something on the Internet, before you share it -- before I
share anything, I will Snope it. I will make sure that I'm spreading correct information. So that is something
that as an individual we need to be more responsible of sharing information because when you think about
it, it has impact farther and wider than you realize. So if you're spreading false information, not only it hurts
you. It hurts people in the community who you care deeply about. So why am I saying that? I'm saying that
because, you know, that's -- I feel like that helps me to be successful, because I don't -- I'm not easily
persuaded. I'm my own advocate, but I also advocate for the people who are voiceless, the people who are
marginalized, they feel oppressed, and they don't -- they can't for whatever reason stand up. And do it
because it's difficult. We don't want to be -- I know I've been told many times, "The nail that sticks out the
most is the one that gets pounded down." So most people do not want to stick out. Everybody, we all want
to ->> Very Asian talk -- well-known in Asia.
>> Yeah, and so we ->> Japanese.
>> -- want to homogenize. We want to harmonize. We don't want to stick out. And I get that, but there are
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
times when a person needs to stand out. For example, I feel like I've been lucky enough to have the tools I
need to have to be successful in America. It is on me. It is my moral obligation to impart what I know to
help others. I know that my situation is not like exactly like yours, whoever is listening, but it's not unique,
either. We all share that universal human experience. We all have struggles. So to go back to your question,
what makes -- you know, how did I come to this point? Acknowledge the people who help you, stay in the
community, and help others. Don't -- I try not to say, "I made it. Too bad, so sad for those of you who didn't
make it. And you're on your own. I am not that way anymore." To do everything I can to help others. So you
know, I even ask that the students I have at the author events at the high school, "Here's my email. Drop
me a line. As me any question you want to ask me, whether it's about writing, or about my refugee
experience, or my acculturation. Write me. I promise you I will return your email. It may take me a week. It
depends on what it is I'm doing, but I will return your email." So anyone who's listening, you can write me at
ChiSmith ->> Oh, my God!
>> -- ChiSmith@ChiBNChi.com [assumed spelling]. And like I said, you know, it depends on my workflow,
but if you have any questions, I really -- I feel like it's -- I want to help others to succeed. I remember what
it was like for me not to be able to speak a sentence. Or I can't even do my homework without looking up all
the words -- and I looked up a lot of words. So I do remember the challenges. I do remember the
discouraged feeling. I remember feeling depressed, and how I went from being very proficient in my
language and did really well to knowing nothing, like being a baby again. So I do remember that feeling. So
I want to reach out to those who are feeling discouraged to know that, you know, life is long. Think of it as a
continuum. And by that I mean don't think of things as black-and-white and binary, as success and failure.
There's many failures before you get to a success. So don't think of it as a failure. Think of it as steps that
you get -- you know, these are the stepping stones. Everything you do in life will help you with the next one.
Nothing goes to waste, nothing.
>> That's great.
>> Even your ->> Yeah.
>> If you even feel like, "Oh, my business didn't succeed." Well, for the next one you won't repeat the same
mistake, will you? I mean, so it builds -- it's like a pyramid. You know, you made a lot of mistakes down
here, and then you get to the pinnacle. Well, you got there because you did a lot of work. You can't go from
A to Z by skipping everything in between. You have to put in the physical work.
>> That's great advice, yeah.
>> So it's just -- surround yourself with people who are willing to help.
>> Yes, peers and mentors.
>> Yeah, it's not weak. Please do not equate seeking for help as being weak. It is not.
>> And ask questions.
>> Ask questions! You know what?
>> Ask for help, ask for help.
>> It's okay -- yeah, it's okay to ask for help because nobody knows everything. Remember that what I
said, "Nobody knows everything. No one." So there are experts in every field. They're there for a reason.
They know they learn -- if they don't know something, they'll -- I would hope that they'd be honest and say,
"I don't know that, but I'll help you look it up." And that -- so take comfort in knowing that it's not weak to
ask questions. I didn't get here on my own. Everything that -- you see successful people?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Right.
>> They didn't get there by themselves.
>> That's a great point. Very true.
>> They have ->> Many mentors.
>> Yeah, I mean, when you look at one successful person, they have a big community who has helped
propel them.
>> They're like on top of a mountain of people.
>> Yeah, and these are supporters. These are the people who believed in them. So make sure that you
reach out. And I know Fresno State would have resources for students to go get some help. So your first
point of contact might be your professor, and say, "Hey, I need help with," and they may -- you know, you
may not know what it is that you need help with. It's like I just said, you know, you don't know what you
don't know. And I've been there. So just start talking. And when you start talking, people can enumerate
what it is that they're hearing. And they'll feedback to you and say, "This is what I'm hearing. Am I right?"
And they would then help you find the resources. And I'm hoping that Fresno State would have the capacity
to have these bodies, or groups, or clubs that would help listen and tease out what it is that the students
might need, and then help them, you know, every step of the way to be successful. But please, I couldn't
say it enough. No one knows everything. Asking is not the same as being weak. You need to ask. And that's
why people are being paid. They went to school many years and get a lot of experience so that they can
help people like you and me. So take heart in knowing that even, you know -- who is it? -- Facebook or
Microsoft, I mean, those people have an army of folks who ->> Oh, Zuckerberg? Yeah.
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> Oh, please, yes!
>> So yeah, get help, by all means.
>> Excellent. Do you -- if we go back to your educational -- the bridges -- like I like to call it bridges, versus
the ->> Sure.
>> Do you remember any bridges that you used? So I hear that you used these bridges of mentors. I hear
that you use these bridges of getting help.
>> Yeah.
>> Were there any like cultural, educational, financial, structural, health, community health bridges? Did you
have any of those?
>> In college?
>> Yeah.
>> So -- okay, so in college, again, I was -- I'm -- I was really big on getting help from the professor. So
whatever I needed, I would go to the professor and ask them for help. And they were pretty good to, you
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
know, help me with the subject matter. I didn't get help with cultural -- like with my acculturation. I didn't
reach out to anybody like that.
>> Did you do any clubs on campus at all? Like did you -- wasn't it Dr. Picasso Howard ->> Dr. -- yeah. You know, I was not really ->> Dr. -- is it Katsu [assumed spelling] Howard?
>> You know, I don't think that I was really involved with a lot of clubs. I was very studious. I pretty much
stayed with just the teachers. And I'm trying to think -- I don't think I did a lot of clubs.
>> But did you -- how do you know Dr. Ng?
>> Oh, how do I know Dr. Ng? Just -- I didn't take a class from him. Like, you know, my husband took a
class from him.
>> Oh, okay.
>> And I think my husband introduced me to him. And then, of course, my siblings all took classes from Dr.
Ng. And so ->> Ah!
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> Okay.
>> So that's how we knew each other. But so I'm going to go down the list. So did I have mentors? So I
didn't have mentors, but when there are people who I respect, like the teachers I loved and respect, I would
go to listen to them. I would look at them and I'd say, "Why is it I love this teacher so much? What are they
actually" ->> So you analyze them?
>> I do analyze them.
>> You analyze them.
>> So that's the part of me I guess I -- maybe that's why I'm an author. I observe people. And then I
dissect what is it about this person that I admire? The people who I admire, they listen. It's not about them,
right? They would listen to you or whomever, and they remember. And then the next time you see them
they'll ask, "So what about that subject matter that you were telling me?" Then that person feels so valued
because you're being listened to. So I -- and it's all about -- the people I respect, and really adore, and you
know, they are my mentor, even though they didn't know it -- so I look at them, "Okay, I'd love to be like
this." So then I would -- when I talk to other people, I want to pay attention to them. I want to give them
my undivided attention and ask about them, because most people want to tell you about themselves. This is
their way of saying ->> Right.
>> -- if -- you know, "Do you value me?" You know, if -- because your time is the most valuable resource,
correct?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> So if you give somebody your time and attention, they feel loved. They feel respected. They feel heard.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
And so I look at those people as my mentors. And these are the people --so I -- when they -- and then when
it's their turn to talk, they talk about -- they don't talk about themselves. They talk about others. And they
talk about things that are interesting to me. They talk about subject matters that I'm interested in, like -- I
don't know -- anthropology, or stars, or whatever the subject matter, or talk about books. So interesting
people -- the people who taught me a lot taught me how to love others, right, how to listen to others,
because when you do that, I think that it gives you -- there's a lot of rewards that come back to you, instead
of saying, "It's all about me." People actually -- like being an author, or talk about whenever I do some
presentation, people don't really care about who I am, honestly. People want to know what it is that they
can learn from me.
>> Right, yeah!
>> Isn't that true?
>> Yes.
>> So what are some values that you can bring to the table? People want to have your takeaway. They
don't care that I had two eggs for breakfast. That's not helpful to them. So those are the mentors I have.
And so I don't really have official mentors. I just kind of grab on or gravitate toward the people who have a
lot to give, you know, take away the values. So those of us who have gone through a lot of challenges -- life
challenges, and refugees, and immigrants, or whatever, we have our -- you know, we all have such difficult
situation that we think nobody cares, nobody would understand, nobody can relate. Well, guess what?
There's a lot of us have gone through a lot of things that you -- maybe not all of it, but we probably
understand some of what you've gone through, some of what you suffer. And so let's verbalize the suffering.
Your suffering could be teaching moments for others. And it allows others to understand us more. So then
the more understanding we have of each other, the more we can give each other. And really it's not a sumzero gain. Just because you succeed doesn't mean that I can't succeed. Right, it's not a piece of -- it's not a
pie. So let's help each other. Let's elevate each other. If I can help you to succeed, I'm happy to do it. And
then you pay it forward. So in the author community, in the short time that I'm in, other authors help me
and I help them, and the consensus is that we don't want anything in return, just pay it forward.
>> Yeah.
>> So my job is to pay it forward. My job is to help others. And I -- it's very fulfilling because when you help
others, it really comes back in a most unexpected way. So I think I -- I think ->> Yeah, that's a great description. So the last part then is -- yes or no, smaller classes? Would you like
smaller classes?
>> Anthropology?
>> The whole, entire school. Or no difference? Yes, no, or?
>> Yes.
>> More co-ethnic professors?
>> More?
>> More Asian, co-ethnic professors?
>> I don't know that that's -- oh, yes or no?
>> Yeah.
>> Yes.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Or -- okay. What about more Asian classmates?
>> No.
>> More Asian ethnic clubs?
>> I'll say yes, but I'd like to expound on ->> Okay.
>> So form my personal experience, the reason why I hesitate to say anything so black and white, because
I didn't have a lot of -- if -- you don't want to give people too many crutches. You want to give them
resources, yes. I'm not against that. By all means, give students resources to be successful. But at the same
time, not to -- if you raise an expectation, they'll come up to meet you with the tools that you give them.
Does that make sense?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> But you don't want to baby them too much or coddle the students too much. So there's the extremes, so
you know, doing too much and doing too little. So I think it's helpful to have our ethnic group represented.
That I agree with, because if you don't -- if we don't have role models in our own ethnic groups to speak
and understand our challenges or difficulties, then it's harder to overcome these challenges. You know, I'm
thinking back in my situation, I didn't have people to hold my hands. And so you know, it's very individual.
Some people challenge themselves to overcome these difficulties, and some people need a little bit more
help. So I think let's err on the side of giving people help ->> Okay.
>> -- and have them identify with the role models that they -- that get their ethnicity.
>> Okay, the penultimate -- second-to-the-last question -- and the last question is actually -- I'll ask later,
the advice to their generation, but what workshops -- college success workshops do you want to see at
Fresno State?
>> Workshops? So form my personal experience, I think as refugees and immigrants we're thrown into a
sink-or-swim mode, survival mode. And so we never had the opportunity to adequately go through the
grieving process. And by that I mean -- I'll break into different groups. So the refugee like myself, we're
thrown over -- I mean, yes, we escape and -- persecution, and so we have life, and liberty, and freedom.
And that's all good. So we have the survival skills where we feel like, you know, we made it over here. Who
are we? What gave us the right to even feel any grief, you know? We should be so lucky -- we should feel so
lucky. So we just march on, stiff upper lip, not even addressing any kind of grief. When you shed your
identity, cultural, social, all of the identity that you -- that makes you who you are -- I was 13. I came over
here, just march on, and never given an opportunity or to have any resources to deal with your grief, right.
And there's so many stages of grief. We just march on. And I think that it kind of backfired on me. When I
was in my 30s, after I had my kids and everything, and when things kind of start settling down, because
now I have my career. I have kids, I'm married, and do pretty well socially. Then you start to think about -you have that -- what's the word? -- Existential question. You know, you question about, okay, who I am?
Why am I here? You know, what value do I have to offer to others? You know, so all of those things. When
the dust settles, then your grief manifests itself in a way that it hits you. It hits you pretty hard, when you
least expect it. Grief is funny that way. And so how do you cope with that? And for me, at that time I turned
to reading, and I -- and it's -- I read a lot of Thich Nhat Hanh. He's a Vietnamese Buddhist Zen teacher.
>> Oh, okay.
>> So Thich Nhat Hanh is -- he's very well-known in the American literature.
>> How do you spell that, to the students?
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> So -- T-H-I-C-H, is one word. Nhat is N-H-A-T. And then the last word is H-A-N-H.
>> Okay, so you can google it. They're going to google it.
>> Yeah, he's written many -- but the one -- one of the ones that I read and helped me was Something
Christian and something Buddha. I don't remember, but anyway, he has many, and really helped me deal
with my identity crisis. And I think that's what it was is that I didn't -- I couldn't really place myself
anywhere. You know, I'm not quite American. I'm not quite Vietnamese. I've been straddling between two
cultures. I've been doing pretty much the co-switching between the traditional Vietnamese Eastern, trying to
fit in, trying to please my parents, and you know, be respecting the Vietnamese community. And then, of
course, do well in American society. So that identity crisis, those -- so books really are what I turned to. And
so, again, I couldn't stress enough with go with some coping skills that's not destructive. So go with books,
and go take walks, go swim, bike, whatever it is you do. You know, give these things a chance. And anything
that would expand some energy -- so you get this endorphin afterward, and you feel good about yourself. So
do something -- some physical activity so that, first of all, it gives -- it makes you immediately physically feel
good about yourself so that you can then deal with the mental part, the psychological part. And earlier on, I
was just saying when times are tough, like I said, you know, I write, I read, I draw. But the other thing that
I do -- and that's thanks to Thich Nhat Hanh -- I think of my -- I thought of myself as a baby. I envision
myself as a child, this helpless child. And whatever it was that I felt like it was -- I was missing out of my
childhood, whether it's a misperception on my part of whatever it was, this is my perception, wherever that I
was lacking or whatever I was feeling, I am now a separate self, and I'm an adult. I'm a capable adult. I'm
going to help bring that child and give that child everything that child needs to transition successfully to be
an adult. So how did I do that? I just look at these pictures of myself, which is a mental picture. And so say
if I didn't feel like I was loved enough or whatever -- whatever the case might be, I would talk to myself and
say -- you know, what I -- whatever I tell -- you know, just love and embrace that child that was you, and
bring that child along. And I think that that really helped me. Again, this was in my 30s when I had this
identity crisis. And you know, it really helped [inaudible] do something that betters yourself, and not a
destructive -- anything destructive that only helps you in the moment, but not long-term. So respect your
body.
>> That is excellent advice.
>> Yeah, respect your body.
>> So the last question -- and I think you kind of answered a lot of that with your other comments.
>> Yeah, in a round-about way.
>> But in six years we're going to have a third generation. They're coming in. The first wave of thirdgeneration. Later on, fourth. What advice do you have? You know, right now people predominantly will listen
to the second generation. What will -- what advice do you have for the second and third -- that's going to be
in six years -- what advice do you have for them to be successful? I feel like you said a lot already, but
they're coming in, and they'll have second-generation parents, and third -- first-generation grandparents.
What advice do you have for them ->> Yeah, so what I'm hearing ->> -- to graduate?
>> Yeah, so the biggest thing for Asian Americans is that we have so much of the family loyalty and respect,
and we're taught to listen to our parents and never question them, never -- we're not supposed to question
or say no to anything. But here's one thing that I have to say, at some point in our lives, we have to learn
about our boundaries and say, "I love you. And I respect you. But I need to do this to get myself in a place
where I'm a happy individual." I know that's difficult for me to even say that to my parents, but at one point
I did.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Oh, wow!
>> Yeah. Well, I did it with a letter first.
>> Okay, what -- goodness.
>> Yeah, so I wrote a letter to my dad, and he actually wrote me back.
>> Oh, wow!
>> So if you can't do that verbally, then do it in a letter. And I know that not all parents will be open to that,
but in your own way -- I do get it. I'm not minimalized, you know, your loyalty to your family if you can't
bring yourself to say that. I completely get it. But in your own way, somehow -- you know, we really need to
put our foot down and say, "I need to do this for myself. If I'm going to get myself out of whatever situation
I'm unhappy with, I am the only one who can actually help myself," right?
>> Mm-hmm.
>> Because if we don't recognize that there's something that is holding us back -- it starts with us, and if we
don't do it for us, nobody is going to come along and do it for us. I mean, in this country, it's all about civil
liberty. You know, you can't tell somebody what to do. We can only encourage them. So I know that that's
probably not helpful, but just learn about your position and your boundary. And think about where you want
to be five years from now, 10 years from now. Visualize what you want to achieve, and then work backward.
And say, "Okay, if I want to be a business owner, how do I do that? Well, do I need a business degree? Do I
need to intern and watch how other people do it? Take lessons from them? What do I need to get there?"
But let's project and see ourselves first. Is that person that you see, is that somebody that you respect?
Right, so that's what I would say to the third generation is hopefully that they would be able to, you know,
do some research for themselves, see -- you know, visualize who they want to become, work backward, and
get help. For goodness sake, get some help.
>> Yes, ask for help. Yes. Ask for help.
>> When I say help, I don't mean it in a demeaning way. We all -- think of it as ->> We all need help, yeah.
>> Yeah, so consultants. There's so many consultants, they make money doing consulting. Do you think
that these consultants work for people who -- you know, these will be successful people, because they how
they get consulting ideas, because we're into ourselves so much we're subjective. We don't see ourselves in
the way that is fair to us. So if we get other so listen to our situation, they can tease it out, and they can
say, "Oh, you want to be such-and-such in five years? Here's the -- here's a roadmap." You wouldn't plan to
go to L.A. without a roadmap, so why would you plan your life without a roadmap?
>> That's brilliant.
>> Yeah.
>> That's definitely brilliant.
>> So maybe that would be helpful.
>> Very.
>> Believe in yourself and advocate for yourself. Don't let others advocate for you. They don't know -- you
are your boss. And so I hope that that has helped.
>> Yeah, that is awesome advice for like your daughter's children.
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]
>> Yeah, definitely. Just shoot -- I mean, really aim high. If we aim so low, it won't take much for us to
succeed. So set your standards high. And because when you're doing that, you're giving yourself respect. So
love and respect are drawn -- are attracted to us when people see that we're kind, thoughtful, and -- you
know, that's how people are drawn to you. And do it because -- for yourself, not because of all the side
effects. But when you're confident, and self-loving, and self-respecting, others will come to love and respect
you, because if you don't respect yourself, people are just going to say, "Ah, well, that's not somebody who I
want to be with -- around," right? So, yeah, that would be something that I would leave you with.
>> Definitely. Okay, all right. Well, thank you so much. Let me turn off the thing. You gave great --
file:///C/...0Southeast%20Asian%20Successful%20Voices/Files%20for%20upload/36__HongChi_Smith-VietnameseFemale_1.5gen.clean.txt[3/10/2022 9:08:35 AM]