Chi Chang interview
Item
Title
Chi Chang interview
Creator
Chang, Chi
Banh, Jenny
Relation
Central Valley Southeast Asian Successful Voices
Coverage
Fresno, California
Date
2017
Rights
Copyright has been transferred to Fresno State
Identifier
SCMS_casv_00001
extracted text
>> All right, today -- would you like to use your name? It's up to you.
>> Yeah.
>> Please state your name, spell it, the date, and please give me verbal permission to interview you for the Central
Valley Barriers and Bridges Educational Stories of Successful Southeast Asians.
>> Okay. My name is Chi Chang, spelled first name C-H-I, last name C-H-A-N-G. And you have my consent to
interview.
>> Great. Okay, so here we start another one. I do a two-tiered, so I'm starting another one. All right, so thank you so
much for coming. It's a pleasure and an honor to actually interview you.
>> Thank you.
>> And congratulations again for graduating.
>> Thank you.
>> And congratulations for being the number one anthropology student. It's impressive. All right, so what is your
gender?
>> Female.
>>What is your birth year?
>> 1993.
>> What is your ethnic group?
>> I'm Hmong.
>> What is your undergraduate major?
>> I double majored in criminology and anthropology.
>> What is your generation in the US?
>> First generation.
>> Where were you born?
>> Fresno, California.
>> Are your parents also born here or no?
>> No. They were born in Laos.
>> Laos, okay. So you were born in Fresno?
>> Yes.
>> That might be considered second generation. Is it first or?
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>> Because my parents migrated here and then I was born here I think six months after they migrated here.
>> Oh, okay. So it might be -- you might be -- you were actually born in the US, right?
>> Yeah.
>> I think you might be considered second generation.
>> Second?
>> Yeah. Just because you'd be first generation if you were born in the other country.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Yeah.
>> All right, that was never really explained.
>> [Inaudible] It's a weird thing. What is your mother and father's highest education?
>> My mother has no education. My father I believe has probably the highest in high school education.
>> High school. What's your family makeup? Like how many brothers and sisters do you have?
>> I have three brothers and a total of five other sisters.
>> Five sisters?
>> No, a total of four other sisters.
>> Wow, okay. Are you the youngest?
>> Wait, I'm sorry. Hold on, let me see. Five other sisters, yeah, besides me.
>> Wow. So you have five sisters, three brothers, and mom and dad and grandparents?
>> Grandma, yeah.
>> And then your family, so they all live in the same house?
>> Yes and no. My oldest brother -- well, my two oldest brothers moved out and my two oldest sisters moved out as
well.
>> What is your GPA?
>> 3.65.
>> Great. What is your degree aspiration? What is your ultimate degree that you want to get?
>> I'm looking at a doctorate.
>> A PhD or ED or MD, which one?
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>> PhD.
>> In, what do you think?
>> In anthropology.
>> Oh, great. Awesome, okay. If you were looking at your socioeconomic background, would you say you come from a
family that's working-class, middle class, or affluent?
>> I would say low, yeah, low working-class.
>> Okay. Did you go to a public or private high school?
>> Public.
>> Public, okay. What was the high school called?
>> Sanger High School.
>> Where is that located?
>> Singer, California. It's like out on the outskirts of like Fresno.
>> Oh, okay. And what was the racial ethnic demographics of your high school?
>> A majority were Hispanics, Caucasians, and then there was the Asian. Very, very, very few blacks. Yeah, very few
blacks.
>> Interesting, okay. How many Hmong go to college and why or why not? Do a lot of Hmong go to college?
>> From what I see, yes. I think they go to get a college degree.
>> Okay, what reason?
>> Most of them would just to get a college degree, because their parents have said so. And then I think the rest go there
to get a better job.
>> Better job, okay. And the ones who don't go to college, why don't they go to college?
>> They don't know what they want to do in college, and they don't -- or they don't see college as important. Or they
just don't like -- they don't understand why college is important.
>> Okay. If you look at Southeast Asians, in particular Hmong Americans, they have a lower rate of going to college
versus South Asians from India, South Asian Americas who have a 70% versus 12%. Why do you think there's a
discrepancy between the different Asian groups?
>> I think there's the cultural part, which is where there's a lot of family responsibilities. The Hmong parents, they do
talk a lot about grades and like higher education and getting college degree. But I think for the most part there isn't a
role model to show us how to get through the system. And then let's say we do have a role model, we still have family
responsibilities to take care of.
>> Such as what?
>> Taking care of our parents. Making sure that let's say our brothers' or sisters' kids are taken care of as well.
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>> So not just your own but your brothers' and sisters' kids?
>> Yeah.
>> Wow, okay. Any other issues?
>> Help with translation and paying the bills. As most Mong parents, they don't read English or understand English.
>> Okay. Do Hmong students have a good relationship with administrators and faculty? Do they have strong
relationships, would you say?
>> Not as much.
>> Why is that? Why not? And how can we make it stronger?
>> I think the main reason is that they're shy and they don't know how to navigate the system. So they don't know who
to reach out to, unless they're approached by the admin or the teachers. And another thing is we don't see other Asians
like us as admins or teachers. So those are some of the reasons.
>> Okay. What is your favorite subject and what is your least favorite subject?
>> My favorite subject is English. My least favorite subject is math.
>> English and math, interesting. So what makes a good professor for a student to pass and do well? What makes a
professor that is not a good professor?
>> I think a good professor -- well, I can actually give a good example. The anthropology department is a really good
example of good professors, because they actually want to get to know their students. They don't try to pick out, you
know, who's the best, who's going to be the one to succeed. They actually open up and talk to all the students that they
can. And they have the cultural understanding, so they understand the student's background.
>> So do you think a professor needs to have cultural understanding?
>> Yeah, a good cultural understanding.
>> Okay, give me an example.
>> Understand that not all students know what to do in college. That not all students have had somebody in their life
that's excelled academically. Also that there's a language barrier when it comes to like talking to families and how our
education is important, as well as access to programs on campus to help the student.
>> Access to programs?
>> Yeah.
>> Excellent.
>> Would you say that you've ever been mentored?
>> Yes, I have, yeah.
>> And can you tell me in what way? And did you seek it out or was it given to you?
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>> I sought it out, I sought out with Dr. Deborah Sexton and Henry Dokker. I would go to their office hours and just
talk about like research projects or like assignments we were doing in class. And I would ask them questions. And they
would reach out and provide me with other materials outside of the classroom.
>> Excellent. So here, now in the second part of it, we're talking about barriers. Did you have any barriers to your
higher education success?
>> Like what?
>> Like financial, social, familial, gender -- if you were a different gender, how would you be treated differently in your
family -- community, health, structural. Did you find any barriers to your success?
>> Yeah. One of the main ones was that my family moved around a lot. So I think when I was in elementary school, we
moved -- I went to I think three or four different elementary schools. And then right after -- actually, during seventh
grade, we moved to Sanger. And then I went to Singer for four years and then we moved back to Fresno. And so my
senior year in high school, I was actually commuting from Fresno here to Singer every morning.
>> To go back to your original high school?
>> Yeah.
>> Oh my goodness. Okay, yes, that's a barrier.
>> And then since I was a girl as well, like I was kind of restricted to just homeschool, and then I guess it still worked
out with my mom. But then my brothers, they were more -- there weren't as much restrictions. They could go hang out
with their guy cousins, stay out late. They didn't always have to be home. And my parents wouldn't question it. If they
leave, my parents wouldn't question it. Even now, my parents are still questioning like where I'm going when I leave the
house.
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. And I wouldn't be allowed to stay overnight. Yeah.
>> So that is a specific gender barrier.
>> Yeah. And I also didn't have like a real visible role model, because either my sisters married early, my girl cousins
married like during their senior high school, or right after they graduated from high school.
>> So you didn't have a role model to go to college?
>> Yeah.
>> Are you the first to go to college?
>> No. I had an older sister who went to Fresno State here, but she was kind of still trying to navigate through. But I did
kind of learn like how to navigate college from her as well. But other than that, like I didn't have any, oh, this is what
you do, these are the programs they have, you know, these are all the majors. And then, of course, at Singer High
School, there was very little Asians there. And there weren't as much programs to help like the minority students.
>> Is it mostly Hispanic?
>> It was mostly Caucasians and then Hispanics, yeah.
>> Oh, interesting, okay.
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>> And I just kind of felt like the school didn't quite understand the minorities on a cultural level, that they would just
focus on test scores and that was it.
>> So you didn't have any specifically oriented towards you?
>> Yeah.
>> Wow, okay. But was there a big Southeast Asia or Hmong population at all?
>> Yeah, there was in the school.
>> Interesting. Were you in charge of taking care of anyone in high school and college such as your parents, your
siblings, your grandparents?
>> Yeah, my brothers' children. There's five of them. And then my sister at that time she had I think three -- no, two
children. And I also had to take care of my grandma as well.
>> Wow, that's a lot, okay. Did you work at all?
>> During high school, no.
>> What about college?
>> College, yes.
>> What did you work at?
>> I started working at fast food for three years, and then I recently -- and I tutored for two years, and then I interned for
the Forest Service.
>> Do you think that impeded or was that a barrier to education, working a lot?
>> Somewhat, because I had to dedicate a lot of time. Of course, the fast food job like the schedule was really just either
like late at night or in the afternoon. And then the tutoring job, I had to rush after teaching in the morning and then
going to class, and sometimes I would be late to class. And then with this internship, it was full time, they wanted me
full time. So I had to do classes like early in the morning or like late late at night.
>> And did you have any financial barriers?
>> Yes.
>> In what way? Did you live at home?
>> Yeah. Actually, the financial barrier has always kind of been like a main thing in my family. The reason -- back in
high school, the reason why we moved back from -- we moved back to Fresno from Singer was because we lost our
house. And so I remembered during my high school years, I remembered surviving on most days just on bread and
peanut butter and jelly.
>> Oh, wow, okay.
>> Yeah. So that was basically what we had for breakfast, and we came home, that's what we had. At dinner we were
lucky, we'd have pizza.
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>> Were you farmers?
>> My parents, when they first came here, they used to have a strawberry farm, but they quit that because there weren't
making much profit. So my mom works at home, takes care of my grandma. And my dad works with Foster Farms as a
sanitation worker. But even at Fresno State here, financial aid was the big financial help for me. And then once I didn't
have that and my job didn't provide much money, that was basically it. I still stayed at home with my family but I didn't
want to rely much on my parents. Because I was like, I'm 18, I want to be an adult.
>> Okay, great. Did you have any academic programs that you sought help at all?
>> I sought out the counseling, the counselors. And I always kind of go back to one specific counselor whenever I
needed help. Besides that, I don't think there were any other programs.
>> What is your feeling towards asking questions? Do you ask a lot of questions in class? Or in general, like if you ask
counseling questions, are there any -- do you ask questions a lot?
>> Not necessarily in class. I tend to be the shy one where I don't raise my hand, I don't answer -- I don't ask questions.
But then when it comes to counseling, yeah, I do ask about like school schedule or like, you know, I'm having these
issues with classes or.
>> Culturally, is it easy to ask questions or is it something that is acceptable to ask a lot of questions?
>> Actually, in the Hmong culture, it's not really acceptable to ask a lot of questions.
>> Can you elaborate on that?
>> Yeah. You kind of just like you're supposed to be obedient and just kind of like listen to what people tell you and
then just do it.
>> But what if you have questions, you just don't ask?
>> You wouldn't ask like the I guess the important people, you would ask the people on the side.
>> So it's a cultural kind of norm not to ask questions?
>> Yeah.
>> Do you think that would be a barrier for other Southeast Asians if they're coming from that kind of culture for
school?
>> Yeah. Because they don't speak up or they don't like answer questions, they're just shy. And so they kind of get
walked over by their classmates and their teachers. And I think that part really played a role in how I was in high school
and college. Because during my senior, my English teacher would try to like put me on the spot every once in a while to
answer questions, and I would just be surprised by it, because he never calls on me. I've never been called. It's the other
outspoken students that have always been called on. And so whenever he called on me, I would always either don't
know the answer or it wouldn't be the right answer. And I would be even more embarrassed talking in front of the class.
Yeah. Because I also kind of felt like I wasn't smart enough, you know.
>> Okay, great. What would make Fresno State a warm or chilly environment for you? Like what makes it warm for
you and what makes it chilly?
>> What makes it warm is that they're open and culturally like accepting of other cultures and ideas. And of course, they
have programs to show that as well. What would make it chilly is if they weren't open to other cultures. If they weren't
open to like current social issues. If they just tried to ignore that now, you know. And it affects the majority of the
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minority students.
>> And now we're going to the third part. But do you think there are things I should have asked you -- anything else that
hampers graduation success? Because, of course, you're the most successful. But do you think that there are any other
barriers that I didn't ask you about, graduation success hampering? Financial, social, cultural, institutional? Is there
anything else you think that hampers graduation success?
>> One of the big parts is financial, because there was one year that I almost wasn't going to be able to go back to
Fresno State, and I had to borrow money. And then another one is culturally on campus, there isn't really a program or
like a club for like Hmong female students.
>> Oh, we do have a Hmong club though.
>> Yeah, but.
>> [inaudible] a Hmong female club.
>> Yeah. Because we have a fraternity from Hmong men.
>> So you want a Hmong female club, okay.
>> So we have a Hmong men fraternity but we don't have a sorority for Hmong women.
>> That's something you could ask for.
>> And I've heard in the past that some of the Hmong administrators have mentioned that if you want a Hmong sorority,
then you would have to start one yourself.
>> Right, that's how it usually does.
>> Then there's another question, well, who do we reach out to? Who's going to support us so we can start this?
>> True, yeah.
>> And how do we make it -- once we have it, how do we make it work on campus and that it will grow? Because the
Hmong fraternity, no one really knows about it. There's very few -- there's probably about 10 members, 10 or 15
members, but no one really knows that there's a Hmong fraternity on campus.
>> Oh, really?
>> Yeah.
>> Good to know. Advertising?
>> Uh-huh.
>> All right, so we're on the last part, which is success. You are the most successful, you're our number one
anthropology student. So what is about your personality, like your psychology, not your group, but psychological
makeup? Why did you have so much success in academics? Like what about your personality?
>> Exceeding in education I felt was my key to get out and not be another statistic. Like oh, you know, she got married
when she was in high school, you know. She's a single mother. She dropped out of college. Like I didn't want to be any
of that. And I didn't want to follow in the footsteps like that either. So I was like, you know, once I get this degree, like
it's my key out, and I could do so much more. I also had role models in the professors as well. And I also found
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something that I was really interested in, which was research. So that kept me going.
>> I love your sleep project, great presentation.
>> Thank you.
>> You have a skill set, excellent skill set. Okay, so you love research.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Anything else? Why so much success?
>> I think it's also because my role as a female Hmong daughter -- because it's like we're always kind of told, oh, yeah,
you know, you go to school, you come home, go to school, come home, do good in your studies. So we didn't really get
a chance -- or I didn't really get a chance to like kind of sway from that track. So my parents always say, you know,
don't do all these bad things, just go to school, go home, go to school, go home. So I guess that kind of mindset kind of
helped me as well.
>> Okay. Do you think -- I think you spoke about this already, but anything in particular about your family that
encouraged you to go to school? I mean, you talked about it, but anything else that you mentioned that they could have
done to encourage you to do well in college?
>> I think if they were more informed of programs that help out students. Like I know the HMSA club, they do higher
education training every year for like senior or junior students. So they learn about like college. I didn't go through that,
I didn't know they had that.
>> So then the advertisement of these programs that you didn't know about?
>> Yeah.
>> You would want to advertise better?
>> Uh-huh. And I think it was only recent that HMSA also had like a parent day for Hmong parents to kind of explain
why college is important. Because when I came here, they didn't have that option.
>> They didn't, okay.
>> Yeah. That was back in 2011.
>> So you didn't know about it. So you'd want them to advertise, okay. All right, so here is now I'm going to write down
everything that you say, a hundred million things that you want in college. Such as, you know, what do you want, you
know, in college. Like do you want church groups? Do you want dance groups? What would help Southeast Asians to
graduate? So like yourself, to be as successful as you, particularly the males, what can we do at Fresno State?
>> Definitely more cultural programs incorporated.
>> Such as?
>> Like you mentioned, dancing, cultural stories.
>> Such as -- what's a cultural story?
>> Like how we came -- how long the Hmong family or Hmongs migrated here. All the different types of -- what is it?
All the different types of barriers that we go through. And then how some of those have become successful. And what
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did they do to get to be successful.
>> Do you want guest speakers?
>> Yeah, guest speakers, yeah.
>> We can do that. Okay, so you want Hmong guest speakers.
>> Uh-huh.
>> That talk about their barriers and how they got successful?
>> Yeah.
>> We can do that. What about classes? What do you want in class?
>> Well, I know that we've incorporated the Hmong language classes, so that's a good start.
>> Right, what do you think of the Hmong miner?
>> The Hmong miner, I think that's really good if I had gotten the chance to when I was still going to school here, I
would have taken it. Because I know that most of the Hmongs, they either don't speak Hmong or they don't know how
to read or even speak Hmong together. And then some people, they just know small parts of like speaking Hmong. So
that's really good.
>> Does co-ethnic professors or more co-ethnic classmates or more ethnic clubs? Does that matter to you?
>> Yeah, that matters too.
>> What about co-ethnic professors or classmates or ethnic clubs, what would you like?
>> What does it mean, co-ethnics though?
>> Do you want more Hmong professors? Do you want more Asian professors? More female professors? I mean, what?
>> Yes, definitely more Asian professors. Because I actually don't -- I mean, I know of two of the Hmong professors
and that's pretty much it.
>> Okay. Did you take their classes?
>> No.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Because they do more like teaching Hmong language, and I know one that teaches French, yeah. [inaudible].
>> And you said you wanted a female Hmong club, right?
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Any other clubs that you want?
>> I don't know. Because I was thinking like a sewing club, because sewing is a big part of the Hmong culture, and
we're slowly losing that.
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>> Sewing club, okay.
>> So maybe we could have like grandmas or moms from the community come and teach, you know.
>> Okay, so you want grandmothers to teach to sew?
>> Yeah.
>> That is something we could do, teach to sew. So that's something like a workshop we could do. Any other workshops
that you would like? I know we had a shaman workshop.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Would you want that?
>> I think, yeah, that would be nice, because not many people understand the Shaman religion. Sometimes they kind of
see it as like, oh, you know, it's like evil or like, you know, it's something that -- I just kind of feel like Muslim Hmong
students these days are kind of like detached from religion. So definitely be informed.
>> Okay, so do you want like a history class, do you want a Hmong history class? Because we do have Anthropology
Southeast Asia. Is there a class that you want or a workshop?
>> I think a class would be helpful, a class on the history of the religion.
>> Of the Shaman religion?
>> Yeah. And how that has changed. Because I know that most families when they come over here, they tend to change
to a different, more American religion, like Christianity, Catholic. And some still stick with Shamanism, but most of the
time they kind of switch over.
>> Oh, interesting, okay.
>> So you want a class on history of -- would you want a class on Hmong Americans or?
>> Yes.
>> Okay. Or would you want it on Southeast Asian Americans, like specifically? Or anything, culture, the music,
anything specific?
>> Definitely the Southeast Asians, just to include other Asians as well, not just the Hmongs, yeah.
>> Would you want Asian-American or Southeast Asians or?
>> Asian-Americans.
>> Okay. All right, and then is there anything that you wanted more? So you talk about financial aid, right.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Would you want more financial aid for students?
>> Yes. And most of the Hmong students don't quite understand how to fill out the paperwork when it comes to
financial aid, or what could cause them to lose financial aid. Because when I came here, I just kind of thought that
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financial aid was going to, you know, keep appearing every semester. But then, you know, I learned the hard way that
that wasn't the case.
>> Okay, so you want a workshop particularly for Asians to teach them about financial aid?
>> Yeah. And then also how to balance their.
>> Let's say we offer a workshop. But would you want it as a webinar, also on YouTube, like many ways to get it?
>> Yeah. Like.
>> You said it wasn't advertised to you. So how could we have gotten to you?
>> Yeah, the webinars would work. Because I know financial aid, they have like YouTube videos online that students
can watch. So students can access whenever they want. Workshops would be nice for students that can make it, they're
on campus. Yeah, so those too.
>> Okay. So definitely we could do that. Anything else that you think is needed? So workshop, financial aid, advertise
it, you know, also webinar, YouTube, and then probably we could do it on Facebook. What else? What are other things?
>> Also, I know they have like workshops on how to balance like their students' loans and how to handle their finances,
but I don't know how they would generate towards the Asian community.
>> You said balance loans and?
>> Finances, yeah. So it's like you have this like two, three grand a semester. You just kind of give that to the lap of an
18-year-old, you know. And they've never had that much amount of money before. Like how are they supposed to
handle it, you know?
>> Does that go to like paying for classes, or is that on top of classes?
>> That's just paying for books, like books for classes. So once after you pay for the books, you have all this money.
Like what you do, you know? You're just kind of like in that shock mode, it's like, wow, I've never had this much
money before.
>> True, good point. So definitely a worship on how to balance loans and finances.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Anything else? You talked about you wanted a female Hmong club. Would you want a workshop on women
empowerment?
>> Yes. Like how we've had like sororities on campus here for other culture groups, but we don't have it for the Hmong
females.
>> Okay, we can do that. We can do it for Asia-Americans.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Empowerment, okay. What else? What would you want in that workshop though? Would you want to see speakers?
Do you want to have some sort of like activity? Like what would you want in the empowerment workshop?
>> Speakers, and to focus on like stigmas or issues within the Asian community. Because there's a lot that people don't
want to talk about.
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>> Okay, such as?
>> Such as being infertile, use of contraceptives, or, you know, victims of domestic violence abuse.
>> I think we do have one for the domestic violence, it's like outsider our school though.
>> Oh, I think that's the Marjorie Mason Center or something like that.
>> I'm not sure. Okay, so workshops on female empowerment, speakers focus on stigmas and fertility, use of
contraceptive. And anything else?
>> Not to be afraid to.
>> You said domestic violence too.
>> Yeah. And I know one of the big issues is that when college is on the horizon, most families don't want their
daughters to go out of town. They want them to stay in town, yeah. So not to be afraid to venture out.
>> So you want this in the workshop or?
>> Yeah, like.
>> So it's kind of like a gender issue?
>> Yeah.
>> Because males can come wander out, right?
>> Yeah, they can.
>> All right, anything else that you think that would be helpful for getting people to graduate? I mean, do you want
cultural festivals or it makes no difference? Or do you want a Hmong fashion show? I don't know, what would you think
we can get specifically Hmong females and men but also Southeast Asian in general. Because all the Southeast Asian
men are not graduating, I mean, very small, like Cambodian small levels. But why do you think the women are making
it so much more than the men? Because it's down the line, the women are doing it. What is the big issue in your
opinion?
>>I think, because I had I mentioned earlier that the mental mindset of like work/school, work/school, you can't really
do anything else. I think that plays a major role. And then for both parts, like the males and the females, they don't really
have visible role models, but I think definitely for the men, because they're kind of just left to do whatever. They don't
really have anybody telling them, okay, you need to like really focus and do this, especially from the males. Because the
males in the Hmong community, they're kind of like that too. Like the older males, like the fathers and the brothers like,
they just kind of feel like they're lost, and they get a job. And they want better for their kids, and so they just tell the
kids, go to school, but they don't know how to show their kids how to do that, especially the males, the males and the
sons.
>> So what can we do at Fresno State? Would we have a workshop for Hmong men?
>> Yeah.
>> [inaudible] But the Cambodian women are graduating, similar to the -- so would you want a workshop just for men?
>> Yeah.
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>> A symposium or what could we cover? Okay, so workshop for let's say Southeast Asian men, it's a big issue.
>> Yeah.
>> With the entire Southeast Asian males. Okay, what would you want in that workshop, to address?
>> For them address like how to navigate college.
>> Okay, so how to navigate, okay, college, okay.
>> And to take it seriously. Because I know that some of them, they go in, they're just like, oh, I'm here at school, but
like, you know, I don't really know what I'm going to do, you know. I think it would be really nice to get like guest
speakers as well.
>> Would you want Hmong male speaking to them or a Cambodian male speaking to them or a Laotian male speaking
to them?
>> I think any Asian male.
>> Any Asian male.
>> Yeah.
>> Would you want that Asian male to speak about male issues of masculinity?
>> Yeah.
>> I mean, I've heard that from some of my interviews. Do you want to talk about stereotype the Asian man?
>> Uh-huh.
>> What would you want that guest speaker, that Asian male, to talk about?
>> That they're supposed to be like the main sole provider. That they're not suppose to be show any emotions. That
they're always supposed to be like the hard-type macho guy. And that it's okay to ask for help.
>> Right. Okay, so definitely in the workshop, to convey that it's okay to ask for help.
>> Yeah, to reach out. Because my second oldest brother, he came to -- my second oldest brother came to Fresno State
for one year, dropped out. And I heard him explain to our guy cousin that he had no motivation. He lost motivation. He
didn't know what he wanted to do. And then he never talked to anybody in our family about these issues.
>> Did he talk to anyone on campus at all?
>> Maybe a counselor and teachers, but not his family. And so my parents didn't know. My sisters, we didn't know
either. Like we knew some resources to help him out, but we didn't know that he was going through these things,
because he never opened up to us.
>> So do you want psychological counseling possibility? Or is it academic counseling or psychological counseling or
both?
>> I think it would be good too, because a part of it is that most of these Asian males tend to not have a good
relationship with their fathers.
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>> Okay, so psychological counseling?
>> Uh-huh.
>> And can you elaborate on that?
>> From what I seen with my dad and my brothers -- my dad is very stern, and when he has something to say to you, it's
always -- he's always yelling at you with big heavy words. And so.
>> Right, it's common.
>> Yeah. So all my brothers never really had like a good relationship with my dad. And so whenever they need help,
they're always very hesitant to come ask for help from my dad. But they don't have that typical Americanized, you
know, father-son relationship. So I think that's also the reason why the males feel kind of lost, never getting higher
education. Because they don't know what's expected of them, and they don't know who to reach out to, and if they can
ask for help.
>> Do the fathers want their sons to go to college? Because you said for a woman, you have to go to school, go back, go
to school. But do the fathers except their sons to go to school?
>> Yes, they do too. But they're lenient towards their sons, from what I've seen. It's like, we tell you to go to school, but
if you're going to go play, that's okay. If you're going to go, you know, overnight with the guys, your girlfriend, that's
okay, you know.
>> Okay. Anything else do you want at Fresno State? You told me 27 things [inaudible], that's great. So I wrote that
down, this is great.
>> Maybe also -- Because I know this applies to like every other student on campus too, but it's like what do you do
after your degree? Like what are the possible jobs? Like are you supposed to intern during your student years? Or are
you just supposed to work, work, work, and then get your degree and then, you know, find a salary job or something.
>> Right. So something like to tell you, like what comes after.
>> Yeah.
>> That's a very good suggestion. Like a workshop or webinar, something like that.
>> Like maybe the Hmong club or the Hmong fraternity or Fresno State can do partnerships with other programs to get
internships for like the Asian community or Asian students.
>> So Hmong club partnerships with Asian community and get jobs.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Okay, definitely, that's something that can be done.
>> Yeah. Because one of the main things that my sister regrets when she was here was that she didn't intern. And so
after she graduated, she had a very hard time finding jobs.
>> Right. Okay, excellent. This is something that we can do. Okay, great. So that's actually all the questions. If you have
anything else to volunteer, I wrote it all down, the 29 suggestions. Actually, you know, this is quite excellent. And a lot
of this stuff, you know, at least can be asked -- you know, we can ask. I don't know if they can give it to us, but we can
ask for it. So is there anything else?
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>> That reminds me. I was talking with one of my Hmong coworkers, and she was trying to help this fellow classmate
who was a freshman at Fresno State -- he's Hmongian. Basically his goal was to graduate high school and work as a
mechanic. And he didn't really have any role models because his brothers weren't going to college. They were just
basically working and playing games at home. And so she and I, we had actually discussed about this, and were like,
you know, we should have a program for like the Hmong males, to like show them, you know, these are the jobs, you
know, that there's life after high school, you know, to motivate them. Because they're.
>> It's a need.
>> Yeah. And we were just talking how like there isn't a program that like that exist at Fresno State.
>> Do you think it should be by a male, not female?
>> I think.
>> Or would it matter?
>> It would be nice to have both a male and a female.
>> Do they need to see like a row of male guys? I mean, would it make them uncomfortable to have Asian women?
>> Maybe somewhat. Because lately now it's like, you know, more Asian females are getting more of like the male or
masculine roles, you know. So I think they would be more comfortable with a male.
>> Would it be like a row of males, like different type of Asian males?
>> Yeah, different type of Asian males, but I don't want them to just be their mindsets specifically just focused on male
stuff. Like I kind want them to kind of help teach the males like important issues about females as well, you know.
>> Okay, that's important. Teach men important. Such as what?
>> That it's okay if, you know, a fellow Asian female student or coworker is a manager, is a lead supervisor, just like
you. It's okay if they have the position. You know, you should value yourself and then value like that Asian -- your
fellow Asian females as well. And that it's okay to work with them. You know, you don't always have to work with just
men, men, men. It's okay to work with females.
>> All right, great. These are so important. So thank you so much. It's like very well thought.
>> I'm glad.
>> Okay, great. Well, I'm going to turn off. Thank you so much.
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>> Yeah.
>> Please state your name, spell it, the date, and please give me verbal permission to interview you for the Central
Valley Barriers and Bridges Educational Stories of Successful Southeast Asians.
>> Okay. My name is Chi Chang, spelled first name C-H-I, last name C-H-A-N-G. And you have my consent to
interview.
>> Great. Okay, so here we start another one. I do a two-tiered, so I'm starting another one. All right, so thank you so
much for coming. It's a pleasure and an honor to actually interview you.
>> Thank you.
>> And congratulations again for graduating.
>> Thank you.
>> And congratulations for being the number one anthropology student. It's impressive. All right, so what is your
gender?
>> Female.
>>What is your birth year?
>> 1993.
>> What is your ethnic group?
>> I'm Hmong.
>> What is your undergraduate major?
>> I double majored in criminology and anthropology.
>> What is your generation in the US?
>> First generation.
>> Where were you born?
>> Fresno, California.
>> Are your parents also born here or no?
>> No. They were born in Laos.
>> Laos, okay. So you were born in Fresno?
>> Yes.
>> That might be considered second generation. Is it first or?
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>> Because my parents migrated here and then I was born here I think six months after they migrated here.
>> Oh, okay. So it might be -- you might be -- you were actually born in the US, right?
>> Yeah.
>> I think you might be considered second generation.
>> Second?
>> Yeah. Just because you'd be first generation if you were born in the other country.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Yeah.
>> All right, that was never really explained.
>> [Inaudible] It's a weird thing. What is your mother and father's highest education?
>> My mother has no education. My father I believe has probably the highest in high school education.
>> High school. What's your family makeup? Like how many brothers and sisters do you have?
>> I have three brothers and a total of five other sisters.
>> Five sisters?
>> No, a total of four other sisters.
>> Wow, okay. Are you the youngest?
>> Wait, I'm sorry. Hold on, let me see. Five other sisters, yeah, besides me.
>> Wow. So you have five sisters, three brothers, and mom and dad and grandparents?
>> Grandma, yeah.
>> And then your family, so they all live in the same house?
>> Yes and no. My oldest brother -- well, my two oldest brothers moved out and my two oldest sisters moved out as
well.
>> What is your GPA?
>> 3.65.
>> Great. What is your degree aspiration? What is your ultimate degree that you want to get?
>> I'm looking at a doctorate.
>> A PhD or ED or MD, which one?
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>> PhD.
>> In, what do you think?
>> In anthropology.
>> Oh, great. Awesome, okay. If you were looking at your socioeconomic background, would you say you come from a
family that's working-class, middle class, or affluent?
>> I would say low, yeah, low working-class.
>> Okay. Did you go to a public or private high school?
>> Public.
>> Public, okay. What was the high school called?
>> Sanger High School.
>> Where is that located?
>> Singer, California. It's like out on the outskirts of like Fresno.
>> Oh, okay. And what was the racial ethnic demographics of your high school?
>> A majority were Hispanics, Caucasians, and then there was the Asian. Very, very, very few blacks. Yeah, very few
blacks.
>> Interesting, okay. How many Hmong go to college and why or why not? Do a lot of Hmong go to college?
>> From what I see, yes. I think they go to get a college degree.
>> Okay, what reason?
>> Most of them would just to get a college degree, because their parents have said so. And then I think the rest go there
to get a better job.
>> Better job, okay. And the ones who don't go to college, why don't they go to college?
>> They don't know what they want to do in college, and they don't -- or they don't see college as important. Or they
just don't like -- they don't understand why college is important.
>> Okay. If you look at Southeast Asians, in particular Hmong Americans, they have a lower rate of going to college
versus South Asians from India, South Asian Americas who have a 70% versus 12%. Why do you think there's a
discrepancy between the different Asian groups?
>> I think there's the cultural part, which is where there's a lot of family responsibilities. The Hmong parents, they do
talk a lot about grades and like higher education and getting college degree. But I think for the most part there isn't a
role model to show us how to get through the system. And then let's say we do have a role model, we still have family
responsibilities to take care of.
>> Such as what?
>> Taking care of our parents. Making sure that let's say our brothers' or sisters' kids are taken care of as well.
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>> So not just your own but your brothers' and sisters' kids?
>> Yeah.
>> Wow, okay. Any other issues?
>> Help with translation and paying the bills. As most Mong parents, they don't read English or understand English.
>> Okay. Do Hmong students have a good relationship with administrators and faculty? Do they have strong
relationships, would you say?
>> Not as much.
>> Why is that? Why not? And how can we make it stronger?
>> I think the main reason is that they're shy and they don't know how to navigate the system. So they don't know who
to reach out to, unless they're approached by the admin or the teachers. And another thing is we don't see other Asians
like us as admins or teachers. So those are some of the reasons.
>> Okay. What is your favorite subject and what is your least favorite subject?
>> My favorite subject is English. My least favorite subject is math.
>> English and math, interesting. So what makes a good professor for a student to pass and do well? What makes a
professor that is not a good professor?
>> I think a good professor -- well, I can actually give a good example. The anthropology department is a really good
example of good professors, because they actually want to get to know their students. They don't try to pick out, you
know, who's the best, who's going to be the one to succeed. They actually open up and talk to all the students that they
can. And they have the cultural understanding, so they understand the student's background.
>> So do you think a professor needs to have cultural understanding?
>> Yeah, a good cultural understanding.
>> Okay, give me an example.
>> Understand that not all students know what to do in college. That not all students have had somebody in their life
that's excelled academically. Also that there's a language barrier when it comes to like talking to families and how our
education is important, as well as access to programs on campus to help the student.
>> Access to programs?
>> Yeah.
>> Excellent.
>> Would you say that you've ever been mentored?
>> Yes, I have, yeah.
>> And can you tell me in what way? And did you seek it out or was it given to you?
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>> I sought it out, I sought out with Dr. Deborah Sexton and Henry Dokker. I would go to their office hours and just
talk about like research projects or like assignments we were doing in class. And I would ask them questions. And they
would reach out and provide me with other materials outside of the classroom.
>> Excellent. So here, now in the second part of it, we're talking about barriers. Did you have any barriers to your
higher education success?
>> Like what?
>> Like financial, social, familial, gender -- if you were a different gender, how would you be treated differently in your
family -- community, health, structural. Did you find any barriers to your success?
>> Yeah. One of the main ones was that my family moved around a lot. So I think when I was in elementary school, we
moved -- I went to I think three or four different elementary schools. And then right after -- actually, during seventh
grade, we moved to Sanger. And then I went to Singer for four years and then we moved back to Fresno. And so my
senior year in high school, I was actually commuting from Fresno here to Singer every morning.
>> To go back to your original high school?
>> Yeah.
>> Oh my goodness. Okay, yes, that's a barrier.
>> And then since I was a girl as well, like I was kind of restricted to just homeschool, and then I guess it still worked
out with my mom. But then my brothers, they were more -- there weren't as much restrictions. They could go hang out
with their guy cousins, stay out late. They didn't always have to be home. And my parents wouldn't question it. If they
leave, my parents wouldn't question it. Even now, my parents are still questioning like where I'm going when I leave the
house.
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. And I wouldn't be allowed to stay overnight. Yeah.
>> So that is a specific gender barrier.
>> Yeah. And I also didn't have like a real visible role model, because either my sisters married early, my girl cousins
married like during their senior high school, or right after they graduated from high school.
>> So you didn't have a role model to go to college?
>> Yeah.
>> Are you the first to go to college?
>> No. I had an older sister who went to Fresno State here, but she was kind of still trying to navigate through. But I did
kind of learn like how to navigate college from her as well. But other than that, like I didn't have any, oh, this is what
you do, these are the programs they have, you know, these are all the majors. And then, of course, at Singer High
School, there was very little Asians there. And there weren't as much programs to help like the minority students.
>> Is it mostly Hispanic?
>> It was mostly Caucasians and then Hispanics, yeah.
>> Oh, interesting, okay.
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>> And I just kind of felt like the school didn't quite understand the minorities on a cultural level, that they would just
focus on test scores and that was it.
>> So you didn't have any specifically oriented towards you?
>> Yeah.
>> Wow, okay. But was there a big Southeast Asia or Hmong population at all?
>> Yeah, there was in the school.
>> Interesting. Were you in charge of taking care of anyone in high school and college such as your parents, your
siblings, your grandparents?
>> Yeah, my brothers' children. There's five of them. And then my sister at that time she had I think three -- no, two
children. And I also had to take care of my grandma as well.
>> Wow, that's a lot, okay. Did you work at all?
>> During high school, no.
>> What about college?
>> College, yes.
>> What did you work at?
>> I started working at fast food for three years, and then I recently -- and I tutored for two years, and then I interned for
the Forest Service.
>> Do you think that impeded or was that a barrier to education, working a lot?
>> Somewhat, because I had to dedicate a lot of time. Of course, the fast food job like the schedule was really just either
like late at night or in the afternoon. And then the tutoring job, I had to rush after teaching in the morning and then
going to class, and sometimes I would be late to class. And then with this internship, it was full time, they wanted me
full time. So I had to do classes like early in the morning or like late late at night.
>> And did you have any financial barriers?
>> Yes.
>> In what way? Did you live at home?
>> Yeah. Actually, the financial barrier has always kind of been like a main thing in my family. The reason -- back in
high school, the reason why we moved back from -- we moved back to Fresno from Singer was because we lost our
house. And so I remembered during my high school years, I remembered surviving on most days just on bread and
peanut butter and jelly.
>> Oh, wow, okay.
>> Yeah. So that was basically what we had for breakfast, and we came home, that's what we had. At dinner we were
lucky, we'd have pizza.
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>> Were you farmers?
>> My parents, when they first came here, they used to have a strawberry farm, but they quit that because there weren't
making much profit. So my mom works at home, takes care of my grandma. And my dad works with Foster Farms as a
sanitation worker. But even at Fresno State here, financial aid was the big financial help for me. And then once I didn't
have that and my job didn't provide much money, that was basically it. I still stayed at home with my family but I didn't
want to rely much on my parents. Because I was like, I'm 18, I want to be an adult.
>> Okay, great. Did you have any academic programs that you sought help at all?
>> I sought out the counseling, the counselors. And I always kind of go back to one specific counselor whenever I
needed help. Besides that, I don't think there were any other programs.
>> What is your feeling towards asking questions? Do you ask a lot of questions in class? Or in general, like if you ask
counseling questions, are there any -- do you ask questions a lot?
>> Not necessarily in class. I tend to be the shy one where I don't raise my hand, I don't answer -- I don't ask questions.
But then when it comes to counseling, yeah, I do ask about like school schedule or like, you know, I'm having these
issues with classes or.
>> Culturally, is it easy to ask questions or is it something that is acceptable to ask a lot of questions?
>> Actually, in the Hmong culture, it's not really acceptable to ask a lot of questions.
>> Can you elaborate on that?
>> Yeah. You kind of just like you're supposed to be obedient and just kind of like listen to what people tell you and
then just do it.
>> But what if you have questions, you just don't ask?
>> You wouldn't ask like the I guess the important people, you would ask the people on the side.
>> So it's a cultural kind of norm not to ask questions?
>> Yeah.
>> Do you think that would be a barrier for other Southeast Asians if they're coming from that kind of culture for
school?
>> Yeah. Because they don't speak up or they don't like answer questions, they're just shy. And so they kind of get
walked over by their classmates and their teachers. And I think that part really played a role in how I was in high school
and college. Because during my senior, my English teacher would try to like put me on the spot every once in a while to
answer questions, and I would just be surprised by it, because he never calls on me. I've never been called. It's the other
outspoken students that have always been called on. And so whenever he called on me, I would always either don't
know the answer or it wouldn't be the right answer. And I would be even more embarrassed talking in front of the class.
Yeah. Because I also kind of felt like I wasn't smart enough, you know.
>> Okay, great. What would make Fresno State a warm or chilly environment for you? Like what makes it warm for
you and what makes it chilly?
>> What makes it warm is that they're open and culturally like accepting of other cultures and ideas. And of course, they
have programs to show that as well. What would make it chilly is if they weren't open to other cultures. If they weren't
open to like current social issues. If they just tried to ignore that now, you know. And it affects the majority of the
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minority students.
>> And now we're going to the third part. But do you think there are things I should have asked you -- anything else that
hampers graduation success? Because, of course, you're the most successful. But do you think that there are any other
barriers that I didn't ask you about, graduation success hampering? Financial, social, cultural, institutional? Is there
anything else you think that hampers graduation success?
>> One of the big parts is financial, because there was one year that I almost wasn't going to be able to go back to
Fresno State, and I had to borrow money. And then another one is culturally on campus, there isn't really a program or
like a club for like Hmong female students.
>> Oh, we do have a Hmong club though.
>> Yeah, but.
>> [inaudible] a Hmong female club.
>> Yeah. Because we have a fraternity from Hmong men.
>> So you want a Hmong female club, okay.
>> So we have a Hmong men fraternity but we don't have a sorority for Hmong women.
>> That's something you could ask for.
>> And I've heard in the past that some of the Hmong administrators have mentioned that if you want a Hmong sorority,
then you would have to start one yourself.
>> Right, that's how it usually does.
>> Then there's another question, well, who do we reach out to? Who's going to support us so we can start this?
>> True, yeah.
>> And how do we make it -- once we have it, how do we make it work on campus and that it will grow? Because the
Hmong fraternity, no one really knows about it. There's very few -- there's probably about 10 members, 10 or 15
members, but no one really knows that there's a Hmong fraternity on campus.
>> Oh, really?
>> Yeah.
>> Good to know. Advertising?
>> Uh-huh.
>> All right, so we're on the last part, which is success. You are the most successful, you're our number one
anthropology student. So what is about your personality, like your psychology, not your group, but psychological
makeup? Why did you have so much success in academics? Like what about your personality?
>> Exceeding in education I felt was my key to get out and not be another statistic. Like oh, you know, she got married
when she was in high school, you know. She's a single mother. She dropped out of college. Like I didn't want to be any
of that. And I didn't want to follow in the footsteps like that either. So I was like, you know, once I get this degree, like
it's my key out, and I could do so much more. I also had role models in the professors as well. And I also found
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something that I was really interested in, which was research. So that kept me going.
>> I love your sleep project, great presentation.
>> Thank you.
>> You have a skill set, excellent skill set. Okay, so you love research.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Anything else? Why so much success?
>> I think it's also because my role as a female Hmong daughter -- because it's like we're always kind of told, oh, yeah,
you know, you go to school, you come home, go to school, come home, do good in your studies. So we didn't really get
a chance -- or I didn't really get a chance to like kind of sway from that track. So my parents always say, you know,
don't do all these bad things, just go to school, go home, go to school, go home. So I guess that kind of mindset kind of
helped me as well.
>> Okay. Do you think -- I think you spoke about this already, but anything in particular about your family that
encouraged you to go to school? I mean, you talked about it, but anything else that you mentioned that they could have
done to encourage you to do well in college?
>> I think if they were more informed of programs that help out students. Like I know the HMSA club, they do higher
education training every year for like senior or junior students. So they learn about like college. I didn't go through that,
I didn't know they had that.
>> So then the advertisement of these programs that you didn't know about?
>> Yeah.
>> You would want to advertise better?
>> Uh-huh. And I think it was only recent that HMSA also had like a parent day for Hmong parents to kind of explain
why college is important. Because when I came here, they didn't have that option.
>> They didn't, okay.
>> Yeah. That was back in 2011.
>> So you didn't know about it. So you'd want them to advertise, okay. All right, so here is now I'm going to write down
everything that you say, a hundred million things that you want in college. Such as, you know, what do you want, you
know, in college. Like do you want church groups? Do you want dance groups? What would help Southeast Asians to
graduate? So like yourself, to be as successful as you, particularly the males, what can we do at Fresno State?
>> Definitely more cultural programs incorporated.
>> Such as?
>> Like you mentioned, dancing, cultural stories.
>> Such as -- what's a cultural story?
>> Like how we came -- how long the Hmong family or Hmongs migrated here. All the different types of -- what is it?
All the different types of barriers that we go through. And then how some of those have become successful. And what
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did they do to get to be successful.
>> Do you want guest speakers?
>> Yeah, guest speakers, yeah.
>> We can do that. Okay, so you want Hmong guest speakers.
>> Uh-huh.
>> That talk about their barriers and how they got successful?
>> Yeah.
>> We can do that. What about classes? What do you want in class?
>> Well, I know that we've incorporated the Hmong language classes, so that's a good start.
>> Right, what do you think of the Hmong miner?
>> The Hmong miner, I think that's really good if I had gotten the chance to when I was still going to school here, I
would have taken it. Because I know that most of the Hmongs, they either don't speak Hmong or they don't know how
to read or even speak Hmong together. And then some people, they just know small parts of like speaking Hmong. So
that's really good.
>> Does co-ethnic professors or more co-ethnic classmates or more ethnic clubs? Does that matter to you?
>> Yeah, that matters too.
>> What about co-ethnic professors or classmates or ethnic clubs, what would you like?
>> What does it mean, co-ethnics though?
>> Do you want more Hmong professors? Do you want more Asian professors? More female professors? I mean, what?
>> Yes, definitely more Asian professors. Because I actually don't -- I mean, I know of two of the Hmong professors
and that's pretty much it.
>> Okay. Did you take their classes?
>> No.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Because they do more like teaching Hmong language, and I know one that teaches French, yeah. [inaudible].
>> And you said you wanted a female Hmong club, right?
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Any other clubs that you want?
>> I don't know. Because I was thinking like a sewing club, because sewing is a big part of the Hmong culture, and
we're slowly losing that.
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>> Sewing club, okay.
>> So maybe we could have like grandmas or moms from the community come and teach, you know.
>> Okay, so you want grandmothers to teach to sew?
>> Yeah.
>> That is something we could do, teach to sew. So that's something like a workshop we could do. Any other workshops
that you would like? I know we had a shaman workshop.
>> Oh, okay.
>> Would you want that?
>> I think, yeah, that would be nice, because not many people understand the Shaman religion. Sometimes they kind of
see it as like, oh, you know, it's like evil or like, you know, it's something that -- I just kind of feel like Muslim Hmong
students these days are kind of like detached from religion. So definitely be informed.
>> Okay, so do you want like a history class, do you want a Hmong history class? Because we do have Anthropology
Southeast Asia. Is there a class that you want or a workshop?
>> I think a class would be helpful, a class on the history of the religion.
>> Of the Shaman religion?
>> Yeah. And how that has changed. Because I know that most families when they come over here, they tend to change
to a different, more American religion, like Christianity, Catholic. And some still stick with Shamanism, but most of the
time they kind of switch over.
>> Oh, interesting, okay.
>> So you want a class on history of -- would you want a class on Hmong Americans or?
>> Yes.
>> Okay. Or would you want it on Southeast Asian Americans, like specifically? Or anything, culture, the music,
anything specific?
>> Definitely the Southeast Asians, just to include other Asians as well, not just the Hmongs, yeah.
>> Would you want Asian-American or Southeast Asians or?
>> Asian-Americans.
>> Okay. All right, and then is there anything that you wanted more? So you talk about financial aid, right.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Would you want more financial aid for students?
>> Yes. And most of the Hmong students don't quite understand how to fill out the paperwork when it comes to
financial aid, or what could cause them to lose financial aid. Because when I came here, I just kind of thought that
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financial aid was going to, you know, keep appearing every semester. But then, you know, I learned the hard way that
that wasn't the case.
>> Okay, so you want a workshop particularly for Asians to teach them about financial aid?
>> Yeah. And then also how to balance their.
>> Let's say we offer a workshop. But would you want it as a webinar, also on YouTube, like many ways to get it?
>> Yeah. Like.
>> You said it wasn't advertised to you. So how could we have gotten to you?
>> Yeah, the webinars would work. Because I know financial aid, they have like YouTube videos online that students
can watch. So students can access whenever they want. Workshops would be nice for students that can make it, they're
on campus. Yeah, so those too.
>> Okay. So definitely we could do that. Anything else that you think is needed? So workshop, financial aid, advertise
it, you know, also webinar, YouTube, and then probably we could do it on Facebook. What else? What are other things?
>> Also, I know they have like workshops on how to balance like their students' loans and how to handle their finances,
but I don't know how they would generate towards the Asian community.
>> You said balance loans and?
>> Finances, yeah. So it's like you have this like two, three grand a semester. You just kind of give that to the lap of an
18-year-old, you know. And they've never had that much amount of money before. Like how are they supposed to
handle it, you know?
>> Does that go to like paying for classes, or is that on top of classes?
>> That's just paying for books, like books for classes. So once after you pay for the books, you have all this money.
Like what you do, you know? You're just kind of like in that shock mode, it's like, wow, I've never had this much
money before.
>> True, good point. So definitely a worship on how to balance loans and finances.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Anything else? You talked about you wanted a female Hmong club. Would you want a workshop on women
empowerment?
>> Yes. Like how we've had like sororities on campus here for other culture groups, but we don't have it for the Hmong
females.
>> Okay, we can do that. We can do it for Asia-Americans.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Empowerment, okay. What else? What would you want in that workshop though? Would you want to see speakers?
Do you want to have some sort of like activity? Like what would you want in the empowerment workshop?
>> Speakers, and to focus on like stigmas or issues within the Asian community. Because there's a lot that people don't
want to talk about.
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>> Okay, such as?
>> Such as being infertile, use of contraceptives, or, you know, victims of domestic violence abuse.
>> I think we do have one for the domestic violence, it's like outsider our school though.
>> Oh, I think that's the Marjorie Mason Center or something like that.
>> I'm not sure. Okay, so workshops on female empowerment, speakers focus on stigmas and fertility, use of
contraceptive. And anything else?
>> Not to be afraid to.
>> You said domestic violence too.
>> Yeah. And I know one of the big issues is that when college is on the horizon, most families don't want their
daughters to go out of town. They want them to stay in town, yeah. So not to be afraid to venture out.
>> So you want this in the workshop or?
>> Yeah, like.
>> So it's kind of like a gender issue?
>> Yeah.
>> Because males can come wander out, right?
>> Yeah, they can.
>> All right, anything else that you think that would be helpful for getting people to graduate? I mean, do you want
cultural festivals or it makes no difference? Or do you want a Hmong fashion show? I don't know, what would you think
we can get specifically Hmong females and men but also Southeast Asian in general. Because all the Southeast Asian
men are not graduating, I mean, very small, like Cambodian small levels. But why do you think the women are making
it so much more than the men? Because it's down the line, the women are doing it. What is the big issue in your
opinion?
>>I think, because I had I mentioned earlier that the mental mindset of like work/school, work/school, you can't really
do anything else. I think that plays a major role. And then for both parts, like the males and the females, they don't really
have visible role models, but I think definitely for the men, because they're kind of just left to do whatever. They don't
really have anybody telling them, okay, you need to like really focus and do this, especially from the males. Because the
males in the Hmong community, they're kind of like that too. Like the older males, like the fathers and the brothers like,
they just kind of feel like they're lost, and they get a job. And they want better for their kids, and so they just tell the
kids, go to school, but they don't know how to show their kids how to do that, especially the males, the males and the
sons.
>> So what can we do at Fresno State? Would we have a workshop for Hmong men?
>> Yeah.
>> [inaudible] But the Cambodian women are graduating, similar to the -- so would you want a workshop just for men?
>> Yeah.
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>> A symposium or what could we cover? Okay, so workshop for let's say Southeast Asian men, it's a big issue.
>> Yeah.
>> With the entire Southeast Asian males. Okay, what would you want in that workshop, to address?
>> For them address like how to navigate college.
>> Okay, so how to navigate, okay, college, okay.
>> And to take it seriously. Because I know that some of them, they go in, they're just like, oh, I'm here at school, but
like, you know, I don't really know what I'm going to do, you know. I think it would be really nice to get like guest
speakers as well.
>> Would you want Hmong male speaking to them or a Cambodian male speaking to them or a Laotian male speaking
to them?
>> I think any Asian male.
>> Any Asian male.
>> Yeah.
>> Would you want that Asian male to speak about male issues of masculinity?
>> Yeah.
>> I mean, I've heard that from some of my interviews. Do you want to talk about stereotype the Asian man?
>> Uh-huh.
>> What would you want that guest speaker, that Asian male, to talk about?
>> That they're supposed to be like the main sole provider. That they're not suppose to be show any emotions. That
they're always supposed to be like the hard-type macho guy. And that it's okay to ask for help.
>> Right. Okay, so definitely in the workshop, to convey that it's okay to ask for help.
>> Yeah, to reach out. Because my second oldest brother, he came to -- my second oldest brother came to Fresno State
for one year, dropped out. And I heard him explain to our guy cousin that he had no motivation. He lost motivation. He
didn't know what he wanted to do. And then he never talked to anybody in our family about these issues.
>> Did he talk to anyone on campus at all?
>> Maybe a counselor and teachers, but not his family. And so my parents didn't know. My sisters, we didn't know
either. Like we knew some resources to help him out, but we didn't know that he was going through these things,
because he never opened up to us.
>> So do you want psychological counseling possibility? Or is it academic counseling or psychological counseling or
both?
>> I think it would be good too, because a part of it is that most of these Asian males tend to not have a good
relationship with their fathers.
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>> Okay, so psychological counseling?
>> Uh-huh.
>> And can you elaborate on that?
>> From what I seen with my dad and my brothers -- my dad is very stern, and when he has something to say to you, it's
always -- he's always yelling at you with big heavy words. And so.
>> Right, it's common.
>> Yeah. So all my brothers never really had like a good relationship with my dad. And so whenever they need help,
they're always very hesitant to come ask for help from my dad. But they don't have that typical Americanized, you
know, father-son relationship. So I think that's also the reason why the males feel kind of lost, never getting higher
education. Because they don't know what's expected of them, and they don't know who to reach out to, and if they can
ask for help.
>> Do the fathers want their sons to go to college? Because you said for a woman, you have to go to school, go back, go
to school. But do the fathers except their sons to go to school?
>> Yes, they do too. But they're lenient towards their sons, from what I've seen. It's like, we tell you to go to school, but
if you're going to go play, that's okay. If you're going to go, you know, overnight with the guys, your girlfriend, that's
okay, you know.
>> Okay. Anything else do you want at Fresno State? You told me 27 things [inaudible], that's great. So I wrote that
down, this is great.
>> Maybe also -- Because I know this applies to like every other student on campus too, but it's like what do you do
after your degree? Like what are the possible jobs? Like are you supposed to intern during your student years? Or are
you just supposed to work, work, work, and then get your degree and then, you know, find a salary job or something.
>> Right. So something like to tell you, like what comes after.
>> Yeah.
>> That's a very good suggestion. Like a workshop or webinar, something like that.
>> Like maybe the Hmong club or the Hmong fraternity or Fresno State can do partnerships with other programs to get
internships for like the Asian community or Asian students.
>> So Hmong club partnerships with Asian community and get jobs.
>> Uh-huh.
>> Okay, definitely, that's something that can be done.
>> Yeah. Because one of the main things that my sister regrets when she was here was that she didn't intern. And so
after she graduated, she had a very hard time finding jobs.
>> Right. Okay, excellent. This is something that we can do. Okay, great. So that's actually all the questions. If you have
anything else to volunteer, I wrote it all down, the 29 suggestions. Actually, you know, this is quite excellent. And a lot
of this stuff, you know, at least can be asked -- you know, we can ask. I don't know if they can give it to us, but we can
ask for it. So is there anything else?
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>> That reminds me. I was talking with one of my Hmong coworkers, and she was trying to help this fellow classmate
who was a freshman at Fresno State -- he's Hmongian. Basically his goal was to graduate high school and work as a
mechanic. And he didn't really have any role models because his brothers weren't going to college. They were just
basically working and playing games at home. And so she and I, we had actually discussed about this, and were like,
you know, we should have a program for like the Hmong males, to like show them, you know, these are the jobs, you
know, that there's life after high school, you know, to motivate them. Because they're.
>> It's a need.
>> Yeah. And we were just talking how like there isn't a program that like that exist at Fresno State.
>> Do you think it should be by a male, not female?
>> I think.
>> Or would it matter?
>> It would be nice to have both a male and a female.
>> Do they need to see like a row of male guys? I mean, would it make them uncomfortable to have Asian women?
>> Maybe somewhat. Because lately now it's like, you know, more Asian females are getting more of like the male or
masculine roles, you know. So I think they would be more comfortable with a male.
>> Would it be like a row of males, like different type of Asian males?
>> Yeah, different type of Asian males, but I don't want them to just be their mindsets specifically just focused on male
stuff. Like I kind want them to kind of help teach the males like important issues about females as well, you know.
>> Okay, that's important. Teach men important. Such as what?
>> That it's okay if, you know, a fellow Asian female student or coworker is a manager, is a lead supervisor, just like
you. It's okay if they have the position. You know, you should value yourself and then value like that Asian -- your
fellow Asian females as well. And that it's okay to work with them. You know, you don't always have to work with just
men, men, men. It's okay to work with females.
>> All right, great. These are so important. So thank you so much. It's like very well thought.
>> I'm glad.
>> Okay, great. Well, I'm going to turn off. Thank you so much.
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